National Insurance Crime Bureau

[Kevin Whiteley]

Does anyone know the outcome of the old posts regarding whether the National Insurance Crime Bureau (NICB) will disclose information related to the owner history of our cars.

As I remember, some posts stated that information was received and others said they didn't receive any information at all.

[Gary F. LeDuc]

Re: National Insurance Crime Bureau

I got stone walled - They would not give my Ins agent any data.

[Patrick T.]

Re: National Insurance Crime Bureau

Kevin, I asked Terry McManmon the same thing about 3 weeks ago, it's down the list on the board. See my post. Terry said it was a bust, they won't talk to the NCRS. By the way, I have a brother Kevin who is an ATF agent and he deals all the time with the NICB and has several contacts down in their Atlanta office. I asked him for some help on getting info on my '67, but he said forget it, so I would't count on a law enforcement agency unless you have a case#, since obtaining info from the NICB under false pretenses is a felony. Patrick

[Bob Lanham #32271]

NICB - Why doesn't NCRS approach GM?

I don't know the full ins and outs of how NICB came to have all of the info they got from GM, but I do know how tough it is to get info that is for law enforcement use only. If GM gave them the info, why can't GM give NCRS a waiver or release of some type to get the info? It seems that would cover NICB on improper disclosure of the info. I think one of the big problems with the info is that a lot of it is hard copy not computerized. NICB doesn't want to be bugged about doing searches. Perhaps an agreement could be reached where NCRS members would volunteer to copy the records at NCRS expense and save NICB the hassle. NCRS could then try to recoup some of the cost by charging a reasonable fee for providing info or document copies to interested parties.

The info can be obtained, but there can be penalties involved. You must also have a very good friend at NICB. My understanding is that any request involving a car before 69 or 70 requires a manual search, so it is not possible to have it done unnoticed.

I know and work with an NICB agent who is a great guy and would be willing to ask him questions on how to handle this or who to contact if it might help.

[Tom Freeman]

NICB Info ?

First I tried searching the archives but could not find anything. Was wonderign what info does the NICB have? From my understanding they can provide the dealer/zone info of where the car was shipped to from the factory. But do they have option information and other details like that?

tom...

[Wayne M.]

Re: NICB (type of) Info ?

Tom --- I was going to ask a similar question, as I've never seen a hard copy of every bit of info they have on a given VIN #. I was lucky, back in the late '80s to get (from a friend of a friend with law enforcement connections, so I'm now an accessory to a felony) the intended delivery dealer, and the expected date of shipment from St.Louis. But I was always wondering if there was other data; if not options, at least some of the info we find on the MSO (Manufacturers Statement of Origin) = shipping weight, taxable horsepower (from which we can somewhat deduce the options).

[Vinnie P.]

Re: National Insurance Crime Bureau

I have tried on a number of occasions to get NICB to release their records to our members. Our letters have gone unanswered. I also tried another company similar to NICB to no avail. The letters I have sent were on official NCRS letterheads, representing the organization as the VP.

On the law enforcement issue, I am a retired detective from a large police dept. in NY. I have used NICB in the past on certain investigations. The only information they have is the date the car was shipped from GM and the NAME and city of the dealer the car was shipped to. In conversations with them, they say they don't have any records as far as options etc.

Previous posts have indicated that you need a case number on an active investigation to receive information, this is true. Having been involved in the NCRS prior to retirement, it was always tempting to use them to get information on a car or cars that I had an interest in, but it wasn't worth taking the chance of jeopardizing my position. Since I retired I have been led to beleive that departments now pay a fee each time they use the service for each and every V.I.N. and I don't think that myself or anyone in a position that has access to the service would want to abuse the privilege and possible consequences.

[L. Taylor]

Re: National Insurance Crime Bureau

They also have how much each car was insured for. If you had a large enough data base, you could look at a particular transport and determine from each car's insured value whether it was an L-88 or a low option base motor car.No fact in it , but just an educated guess

[Patrick T.]

Re: NICB (type of) Info ?

"You have the right to remain silent, anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law", but I won't tell.Patrick

[Jeff]

How useful would the info really be?

My understanding (and I happy to be corrected) was that the Corvette info the NCIB has is the car hauler stuff meaning the things they cared about like VIN, weight, value and where it was going. Other than where a car was delivered, what can the info tell you that would be meaningful and even that doesn't mean much except in rare cases?

Maybe they'd be willing to release some but not all of the info to NCRS, like the older records which cover cars not very likley to be used in the commission of a crime or be stolen. Not many banditos riding C1s these days, right? But if I recall the entries don't start until Jan 61.

JP

[Wayne M.]

Re: How useful would the info really be?

Jeff --- A copy of the MSO would be better, but the NICB info would at least be a start; look at the number of requests for previous owners in the DRIVELINE. I would say that (even) most NCRS members don't know where their car was initially delivered. With that info, you START searching in that state's motor vehicle records, or in surrounding jurisdictions, and you progress from there. The NICB data would reduce the haystack to a small pile of straw, of course with your Corvette being the needle.

The VALUE of the data that GM sent to the NICB (correct me if I'm missing something) ended when the Corvette arrived safely at the dealer. IMO, their resistance to release this data base to a responsible organization (National Corvette Museum / NCRS) is nothing but an example of extreme anal bureaucracy operating at its best.