C2-Knockoff wheels

[Tony Reilly]

Hi Guys,
I'm going to look at a '64 this weekend that has KO's on it. I've read everything I can find in the archives and elsewhere about identifying KH's versus repos but haven't found anything definitive.

Is there anyone out there that knows some precise measurments, such as the depth of the rim edge concave area as measured by placing a straight edge across the "valley" and measuring from the "valley floor" to the straightedge, or the dimension in 1/1000 inch of the fins at several identifiable places? I've read that these dimensions are different than the common repo wheels. Keep your fingers crossed-this may be the one!
Thanks
Tony

[Duke W.]

Re: C2-Knockoff wheels

I would go on assumption that they are repros unless otherwise proven. Since factory installed KOs included the spare, check the spare. If it is an original type KO it will have "K-H". Early repros say "Western Wheel" and later repros may say both "K-H" and "Western Wheel" since K-H bought Western, sometime in the eighties as I recall.

Only 806 original KO equipped '64s rolled out of St. Louis - less than four percent of production, so the the chance that this car was an original KO equipped example is slim, and original KOs would be quite weathered by now. KOs did not have any kind of coating on them so pitting is common, particularly from salt, and even a well restored set is likely to have pitting on the machined flange that is visible to close inspection.

Duke

[Jack H.]

Re: C2-Knockoff wheels

Hum, there's a daily driver '64 FI coupe in my chapter that's signed by Zora with factory original KH KO's on 'er that look virtually pristine. It did the Founder's trek to Sun Valley in '99 without heavy breathin' and has been on quite a few chapter/regional meet runs with us. I'm not sure I'd write off a '64 with KH KO's as being 'suspect' simply based on statistics.....

It's a matter of simply looking at what's there and asking for what documentation the car has. If one doesn't know what he/she's looking for in terms of factory originality on KO's, getting a micrometer set of specifications isn't going to help all that much.... Folks like Dennis Portka did a bang-up job for a number of years 'massaging' aftermarket repro KO wheels to visually resemble the real McCoy stuff!

My advice is either recruit a judge who knows his stuff or have the seller provide 'suitable' source documentation for the car. The latter is the better approach as these wheels WERE sold across the counter in spare form and more than one prior owner couldn't resist the temptation to make an owner/dealer inspired vehicle configuration change....

Even IF this was done, a set of real McCoy '64 KH/KO wheels is worth good money. So, it's one thing to assess whether or not the wheels on the car are the real item and, similar to asking how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, whether or not that's the way the car was originally factory equipped. But, I wouldn't, out of hand, doubt authenticity or 'expect' undue wear/tear just because a given car is aged....

[Mike L.]

Re: C2-Knockoff wheels

I own a 64 Coupe FI with a set of orignal KO wheels they are rubber stamped on the back side. The rubber stamp was used ONLY on 64 wheels. NCRS 63-64 judging manual say's that the earliest known car was #5054 BUT I've done my own survey in the Driveline and other mags. and found original owner of early cars (with paperwork) as low as #1497 VA. car, #1971 Alb. car,#2094 Canada car #2405 Ct car #3285 (Atr McNay car) and more!!! Now I'm trying to put this all together for the 63-64 NCRS Team Leader to look at. If they want to!!!

[Mike Yager]

Re: C2-Knockoff wheels

You may already know this but two quick things to look for before going into measurements and other details:

- Jacking instructions on the underside of the board that covers the jack storage area. Although reproduction instructions are available, you can usually tell one that is original by the condition of the board and the sheet. Instructions were different for K/O cars.

- Anything that says "Taiwan" or a source that is not made in the US on any part. You can usually see this on the inside of the spinner cap.

Good Luck!

[john pickens]

Re: C2-Knockoff wheels

One other Question...

My restored 65 roadster has knockoffs, and I assume they are repros.
This is fine by me. I do want to know if there is an easy way to be sure
whether or not the wheels are secured only by the spinners or whether they
are secured by bolts or pin beneath the hub. Can this be determined without prying off the center hub?

[Jim38243]

Re: C2-Knockoff wheels

A real KH Knock Off does not have any lip on the inside of the rim. In other words if you place your hand inside the back of the wheel and drag your fingers from the fins back to the inner rim it will be flat. No rounded ledge or drop off in the construction of the rim, just flat all the way to the inner edge of the rim. If it has a ledge its a repro. I have probably one of the first repro KO's made and they look great it even has part of the KH lettering in the casting and there are no safety pins. Not many repro wheels were made without safety pins which you will only be able to see if you pry off the center cap.
Good luck!

[Mike Yager]

Re: C2-Knockoff wheels

I don't know of anyway to determin this without prying off the cap for the center spinner. You can try a large suction cup for this. It seems to work well for this.