Engine paint & color

[Tom Sarno]

I would like to paint the motor for my '74 using a single stage urathane and was wondering if there is a production car that is about the same color. Also, should the '74 have the orange or the red/orange color?

Thanks
Tom

[Patrick H.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Tom,

I've heard that 1969 Camaro Hugger Orange is a close match. I'd assume (?) that some of the larger paint companies would already have this coded for single stage urethane.

Patrick

[Joe L.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Tom-----

Chevrolet engine "orange" was not the same throughout the 1957 to 1977 period of its use. In the 65-67 time frame there was a lot of red in it. From 68-71, there was some red, but a lot more orange. By 1974, the year of your car, it was mostly orange with just a "hint" of red.

[Robert Thomas]

Re: Engine paint & color

Joe,

I have seen many questions you have answered. Thanks, on behalf of everyone you have helped. Maybe you can answer some of my questions.

I have a 1971 numbers matching 454 356 horse LS5 motor with air and original heads that I am in the process of rebuilding. I would like some information on the inside as well as on the outside of the motor.
Let's start with the outside. I would like to know what it would take to adhere to an original condition as I am having the engine rebuilt. What was painted chevy orange (freeze plugs, oil galley plugs, head bolts, valve cover bolts, oil pan bolts, etc.)and what was not? Where can I find the "correct" bolts for the motor (accessories, heads, intake)?

The inside: I would like to upgrade the power a little. Do you recommend punching out the valves to a larger size? Say 225 exhaust? What type and size of cam (around .520 lift) do you recommend, Pistons (hyperutectic?) rings, gaskets, timing chain, valve springs, assembly bolts, etc.? i think the block has been bored already at .030

Any response would be greatly appreciated.

Bob

[Joe L.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Bob------

Your engine was originally painted after it was completely assembled and prior to shipment to St. Louis. Consequently, everything that was "exposed" was painted. This included block soft plugs, exposed cylinder head bolts (i.e. those not under the valve covers), valve covers, valve cover bolts, water pump, oil pan, oil pan bolts, bellhousing (usually painted just about completely on big blocks), and any accessory brackets installed on the engine at the engine assembly plant. You can determine which brackets were installed at St. Louis (and, consequently, not painted engine color) by referring to the LS-5/C-60 section of your AIM.

Painting of the block often evidenced many "holidays" (areas which didn't get paint applied. The front cover area under the water pump and block side area (usually including one or more freeze plugs) under the exhaust manifolds are the 2 most notable. Personally, I don't like to re-create this "element of originality" and like to completely paint the block, leaving no exposed areas.

Paragon offers reproductions of most engine fastners. For head bolts, I would use new GM (which are not exactly like the originals, but are very close) or, better yet, ARP (not at all like the originals). If your current head bolts are "first-run" (i.e. have not been previously removed and re-installed), then you can clean and re-use them. Most other engine fastners, if they're original and in good condition, can be re-used.

As far as the engine goes, I'd recommend the following:

1) hypereutectic cast pistons. Don't raise the compression ratio above 9.0:1 from the existing 8.5:1. Keith Black #KB-200;

2) Piston rings: Speed-Pro/Sealed Power;

3) forget increasing the valve size. There's too much risk of ruining an original cylinder head and you don't need an increase in valve size for the kind of mods which are practical for your engine/use;

4) retrofit hydraulic roller cam. Something around 270-280 degrees advertised duration and between .500 and .575" lift. Speed-Pro 1072R, Comp Cams 11-420-8, or Crane 139621. I would not use any camshaft which is "wilder" than these if you want to have satisfactory and pleasant street operation. If you don't want to go hydraulic roller, you can use a standard flat tappet hydraulic. If so, I wouldn't use one with greater than 270 degrees advertised duration or greater than .525" valve lift;

5) valve springs and lifters: use the springs and lifters recommended by the camshaft manufacturer for the cam you choose;

6) push rods: use the specific push rods designed for use with the hydraulic roller lifters used. If using flat tappet hydraulic, use stock GM push rods;

7) timing set: use Cloyes Tru-Roller #9-3110. If you use an hydraulic roller cam, use Cloyes #9-3110T;

connecting rods: use your stock rods, reconditioned and resized with ARP Pro Wave-Lock rod bolts. For new rods, use set GM #12496661;

9) main and rod bearings: stock GM or Federal-Mogul aluminum;

10) cam bearings: Durabond

11) Head gasket: Fel-Pro #1017-1

12) Oil pan gasket: Fel-Pro, one-piece #OS-30061T

13) oil pump: stock GM #14067529 or Melling equivalent

[Craig S.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Joe - out of curiousity, I see you mention Durabond cam bearings instead of FM SpeedPro as in the rod/main bearings. What is the reason for this, and, do they have a version for 66 BB's as well for the rear bearing? Thx, Craig

[Joe L.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Craig-----

Durabond cam bearings are the absolute best on the market. After learning about them, I would now use nothing else. They are the ONLY source for cam bearings for CNC machined big blocks (Bow-Tie and ZL-1) and that's how I discovered them.

Durabond bearings use a seamless outer shell. Stock GM and most other cam bearings have a seam.

I seriously doubt that Durabond makes a cam bearing for the 65-66 big block rear cam bearing application, but it's possible. You'd need to check.

[Craig S.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Thanks Joe, I had never even heard of them. Do you get them through performance parts dealers, or normal machine shop suppliers? Hope I have a shot at using them if I can get the right bearing for the rear journal, although I suppose I could use the set in the other positions except the rear journal...Craig

[Joe L.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Craig-----

You can get them from either type of supplier you mentioned. I think that Summit carries them.

[Craig S.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Joe - I will check Summit, I have been using them a lot lately...thx!...Craig

[Robert Thomas]

Re: Engine paint & color

Joe,

Thanks for your help. I will go ahead and have the block and bolts painted the same color. As for the engine, I have had some suggestions from others to go with the 1970 specs. What do you think? I agree with you on the heads. It's just an easy way to pick up some great horsepower!

Thanks for your help.

Bob

[Craig S.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Joe - Thx for the tip, I found Dura-Bond on the web and looked in their catalog in pdf file format. The bearings I need are CH-9A, the CH-12A is the 67 up style. They don't have the coated versions in the 65/66 style though. Thx!...Craig

[Joe L.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Bob-----

Basically, the only difference between 70 and 71 LS-5 specs is the compression ratio.

[Patrick H.]

Re: Engine paint & color

Bob,

If the 1970 vs. 1971 changes for the big block are the same as the small block difference, then all they did is change the head combustion chamber size. I know that the bottom end of a 1970 300 horse motor is virtually the same as a 1971 270 horse motor, which is EXACTLY the same as the 1972 200 horse motor. The same is true of the LT-1's of those years.

As a result, since you really can't "decrease" your combustion chamber size in a practical way there isn't an easy way to do it.

Just a thought.

Patrick