Rebuilt Title

[Richard Hayes]

We recently tried to put our 1987 coupe up for sale on E-bay. Only to find it unlisted the next day due to a "violation of E-Bay's guidelines. Have owned the car since 1998 and at the time there was nothing on the title that would indicate "Rebuilt or rebuildable." We are the third owners-and the previous gentleman told us the car had never been wrecked. The car had it's original two tone paint except the hood had been repainted. But it is the original hood w/o any evidence of damage. So we assumed the best.
Well 5 years later-in the process of trying to sell the vehicle- to the best of my knowledge ( and previous owner's words) the vehicle has never been wrecked- yet the Georgia DMV says different. Due to the title records not kept for more than five years- we have no way to know if it's a mistake or not. Yet if you do a Vehicle history check-it shows up from 1996 as "Rebuilt or Rebuildable."

My thoughts are to find the previous owner-and do I have a legal recourse if it has been misrepresented or how to go about fixing a mistake if it is that?

Any help is appreciated!!!

Richard

[Mike M.]

Re: Rebuilt Title

suggest you take it to a local auto auction , sell it there and lick your wounds. Dealing with a DMV is ulcerogenic. Hiring a lawyer would probably cost more than anything, if any, you'd recoup from previous owners if the judgement went in your favor. good luck, mike.

[Karl #35089]

Re: Rebuilt Title

Hi Richard: I am very interested in this subject. When you say "vehicle history check" shows "rebuilt" what exactly do you mean? Also, do you indicate that the DMV where the car is titled shows no such history? Was the car ever titled in another state? What does your certificate of title say in this regard? Either I am misunderstanding what you are saying or something's quite odd here. (Feel free to e-mail me directly if you want.) -Karl

[Patrick H.]

Re: Rebuilt Title

Karl,

Those are some good points.

I'd think of the following:

1. Run a Carfax on the vehicle. It's the cheapest, fastest and easiest way to get all the information you want.
2. You may have better luck with a policeman friend looking up records on theft than you will the state's DMV.
3. Some states do not "transfer in" the information as to whether or not a car has a Rebuilt or Salvage title. For instance, a friend's rebuilt Saturn had a Rebuilt title in MI, but not in Indiana. The prior owner may not have known.
4. Some states will require a car be "totalled" if it is involved in a flood, no matter how small the damage may be. You may be lucky enough to have one like this.

I'd run the carfax first, but in the end Mike's option may be the best.

Patrick

[Bill W.]

Re: Rebuilt Title

rebuilt or salvage title does not mean it had to be wrecked. it could have been stolen & recovered after the owner was paid off, flood damage, its a law if water gets in the dash it will be totaled. with some ins co. if water goes over the rocker panels and the est is over 30% of the retail value it is totaled. car fax is a very poor way of tracing damage. some states clean salvage,repo,& rebuilt titles. but if they re enter it could pop up again .you would be suprised how many owners & states some of these cars have had over the years. good luck
Bill

[Richard P.]

Re: Rebuilt Title

Find a wreck rebuilder. They know how to fix your problem.

[Mike Yager]

Re: Rebuilt Title

Richard:

It sounds like you need to find the original owner. Since the car is an '88, you should be able to get a copy of the car's window sticker from GM. That should help you find the original dealer that sold the car. If they are still in business, they may be willing to tell you the owner, especially given the circumstances since there is a basis for your research. Also you might get lucky and the selling dealer located in a state that still has the registration records. Most don't keep them for more than 10 years but some do.

Its a bit of a long shot but worth a try. The worst you will get out of it is a copy of the original window sticker.

[Harmon C.]

Re: Rebuilt Title

If you want a copy of the window sticker you need to call the National Corvette Museum they should have the records for a fee. You would then know the dealer it was shipped to. I agree with others who said to sell at auction or as is.

[Richard Hayes]

Re: Rebuilt Title

I am the third owner. I have the business cards(service writer & salesman) that sold the car in NY (Curry Chevrolet). I have done a CarFax report when E-bay said I was in violation of their policies. (I guess they don't check the "Parts & acc catagory...!!!) This is where the "Rebuilt/Rebuildable" title came up as registered in 10/96 in Georgia and have that title number ( when the second owner registered the car) So I'm guessing something happened between NY and Georgia- but for it to be a "total" for the insurance company, I would think I'd be able to "find" that amount of damage or replaced parts. I just replaced the radiator last week and nothing has been touched since it left the factory in 87. The hood has been repainted but no fiberglass damage and the headlights and all are original.
Georgia only keeps the records for 5 years- The second owner told me it had never been wrecked-and he had owned for a year and a half -and didn't drive it much- and had purchased it from the original owner in New York. The car had 60k miles on it and it was in excellent shape.

So...what to do - I guess I will try NY records and see what I can find there.
Seeing that it has a "rebuilt title" and the car has been just a few problems-maybe instead of take the loss- build/addon to my garage?!!!

If anybody needs a title search- let me know. I have about 58 days left of unlimited searches- Just e-mail me.

Thanks for the input-

Richard

[Patrick H.]

Re: Rebuilt Title

Richard,

In addition to checking with the first owner, it MAY be possible that one of the States made a mistake. I know it's hard to believe that would happen, but it may be the case here.

Did the Carfax show anything else?

Patrick

[Karl #35089]

Re: Rebuilt Title

Richard: As Patrick indicated, don't overlook the possibility of an error in the bureaucracy somewhere. That said, some things to consider...

Carfax is basically a global search of the public record. It is difficult for me to understand how they could show something that the state in question does not show. That is where I would focus my investigation if I were in your place.

A couple of things on title branding... you assert that the car had to be "totalled" to be branded 'rebuilt'. Not so. As Patrick stated earlier, it could have been a flooder. It could also have been a strip. Even if collision damaged, title branding is a function of many factors, not the least of which is the mood of the insurance adjuster at that moment. I've looked at a crasher that I could have had looking like new in less than 2 hours - that had a salvage title. I've seen several that were wiped right out but have clean titles (AND clean carfax by the way. SAY IT AIN'T SO! They sure have good marketing, though. Don't they? ...but I digress).

IN THE END, I'm not sure how much I'd care - selling it as is should not pose a problem. Be very forthcoming about the car and the title while selling it and you are looking at probably a 15% hit. Spend a little time looking for an error, then move it down the road and get on with life. JMHO, Karl

[Dave Suesz]

Put not your faith in CarFax...

I looked at a '97 Explorer last year, COMPLETELY CLEAN CarFax report, but you could see the wheels were out of line. Local shop put it on their laser frame machine, discovered the car had been hit so hard in the left front the frame had been totalled, engine hit firewall. Suspensions mounts had been welded back on, front of body replaced, NO RECORD OF REPAIR!

BTW, in my work with old Mustangs I have heard of problems with state officials that would curl your hair. Pre- '68 Mustangs had the VIN under the hood, not on the dash. Many officials refuse to look under the hood, claim the lack of dash VIN means the car is stolen! Don't get me started, I have heard dumber than this!

What you need is the services of an expert Car Tag agency. I built a Turbo Corvair once from the bare junkyard shell of one car and a complete but rotted out rolling car. He knew the law well enough to get me a clear title for the original VIN on the shell.