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Just saw a 1964 Corvette Conv. on e-bay for sale and it was in my home state BUT the trim tag that was listed was for a Blue Ext. and a Blue Int. car. The item # is 2435472789 it is advertised as a Matching numbers, Corvette for sale is Red with Black int. Another example of a car dealer taking advantage of resale red.
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Re: E-bay Watch
Mike-----
Many Corvettes have been re-painted and re-trimmed "along the way". The vast majority of the time, folks don't bother to change the trim tags. Most of the time when this occured, folks were just trying to please their own tastes and didn't care, at all, about judging considerations.In Appreciation of John Hinckley -
Re: E-bay Watch
Fourteen years ago (1989) I purchased a 50K mile window sticker/protecto-plate, build sheet/delivery papers 67 300 HP A/C convertible for my wife. Car had been sitting since the mid 70's. Car was an abosolute perfect NCRS Bowtie candidate with everything correct/original down to the dated shocks. Drove the car for 2 years then did a frame-off. I asked my wife what options/colors she disired and handed her the option/order sheet for 67. She ordered herself a new 67 Corvette in 1992. The car was silver/black orginally. Today the car is 1967 Lyndale blue with black/white interior. It has every option including speedwarning, bolt-ons etc. Most options were not on the car new but they are now. We changed the color and interior to her preference. The car is totally correct appearing down to the chalk marks, correct head bolts etc. However it is totally different than originally delivered new. We did not change the trim tag. Obviously the original paperwork will also tell the tail.
The point of this post is that there are some of us who like a correct appearing car but will make it to suit our need or taste. You would never know our car was not deliverd as it appears today, but it is totally different! We did the car for ourselves. Is it for sale, no! Will it be for sale in the future, absolutely! One day she will get tired of the car or die.
Many people have commented at what idiots we were to make the changes we did. It's our car and WE like it. I know that owners who made changes to cars such as listed in the ebay auction made changes for similiar reasons that were viewed as foolish as ours. After all, these really are just old cars!
Besides, changes give restorers a challenge, parts vendors sales and Corvette enthusiasts something to talk about!
Mike Strinich
#11202Comment
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I like original but it's YOUR car...
a shop I work with was brought a '68 Mustang GT years ago, car was a graduation present in '68. Guy ordered the car, parents went down and discovered he'd ordered a convertible. Horrified, they changed the order to coupe. 20 years later, he brought the car in and said "fix it". Ended up with perfect show correct convertible (doing this to a unibody is complicated like you wouldn't believe). Left the original data tag as is. Drives people nutz. It's your car- do what you like- my pleasure is to try to get my '55 as original as possible, not easy when "experts" tell me things my Dan knew were'nt so etc., no AIM, few original examples, etc. If I didn't like the original color, I might have a totally different attitude.Comment
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Re: E-bay Watch
Early in NCRS when only 53 to 62 Corvettes were allowed, changing body color was OK. Then came the 63 to 67 Corvettes that had trim tages, those owners pressured NCRS to ask early owners to verifie that thier Corvette was the color it came with or if it was changed.When once a 54 Corvette was a first flight in red color, if it was discovered that it was white originaly it now became second or third flight. Togeather Noland and I discovered that Corvettes from 58 to 62, the original color for them was hidden in places most know of today
As editor I wrote about this in SACE in 1989. But 53 to 57 owners were left to verifie weather they change the color or not, causing many old timers of NCRS to leave. NOTE: and today Mid-years now have Bogus trim tags "how nice".
I"m sorry to say that we're at a point IF a made up Corvette fools most of the people and judges most of the time, it becomes original in ( parts, originality, trim tags, HP, you name it.)
The truth may hurt, but dosen't the truth hurt??Comment
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Re: E-bay Watch
It is hard to say why the car is a different color now. Could be the dealer painted it, could be a previous owner preferred red, so on. One thing is for certain, I would prefer that whomever repainted the car left the original trim tag on, as they apparently did here. Some cars today have no trim tag, or even worse, have a falsified trim tag. At least this way you know what you are dealing with. Appears to be a decent driver.
Kevin #39927Comment
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i know nothing about judging but
i would think that having the original color would make more sense than having the orignal oil filter. JMHOComment
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Everyone isn't in NCRS
Like Joe said, often people build their cars without regards to NCRS Judging Manuals. Some of this is they don't care and some is they are not even aware of NCRS.
But almost everyone knows that original cars sell for more. So depending on their knowledge of Corvettes and restoration, they "restore" their Corvettes to what they think is original. This is why you see Corvettes advertised as "all original" or "numbers matching" if they simply have a 327 in a '63 (isn't a 327 the "right" number?). This is why you see '64 dashes in other years, '63s with a '65-7 dash, seats from other years, and so on. They are Corvette parts, so aren't they "correct"?
These aren't the people to condemn. They are just ignorant of a full correct restoration according to NCRS. They may simply want their car to be their way. Or they want the Corvette they didn't get to buy when 16 years old.
Until the late '70s, very few worried about original. Most did it "their way" in regards to everything on a Corvette. You have a 250 hp 3 sp convertible and you want more go and stop? Drop in a 396, a Muncie, and bolt on the disc brakes from a later model. Hate the ride of '63 seats on a long trip? A set of the new '79 lumbar support seats will work. Can't stand the reflection in the '63 gauges? No problem, a '66 dash bolts right in and is easy to read. This is how the Corvette hobby was until the restoration madness that leads to "disagreements" on here and other boards frequently.
The ones to condemn are those who restamp engines, stamp new trim tags, print new paperwork, and so on in an effort to "prove" their cars are all original as from the factory, when in fact they have been manufactured in the last few years.
It would all end if people simply paid for the quality of a car (like they used to pre-80) instead of paying extra for supposedly "matching numbers" and "all original". As long as someone blindly pays extra for those two, people will gladly create those cars for you to buy.
Read the Driveline and you'll find ads for places that make matching number short blocks. Buy an NOM for $20,000, buy a matching numbers shortblock for $2500, and suddenly you have a $30,000 numbers matching car.
For something you may not have noticed, the ad was qualified by it being "matching numbers drivetrain". He didn't say the color was original.Comment
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Re: E-bay Watch
> Early in NCRS when only 53 to 62 Corvettes were allowed
Thanks, Roy, it was good to hear that. Many today forget or don't know how NCRS was long ago.
Also there was more emphasis on preservation because many were afraid the original '53-62 cars would all disappear and no one in future generations would even know they existed.
Today, the emphasis is more on restoration, which in most cases destroys the originality. A restored car may look just like an original, but it isn't original. New paint, new markings, new parts - no matter how much they look like original, they are new and not original.
And with age, many begin to assume that one restored years ago to look original is original because it now looks old.Comment
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