Visual Aides for Judging - need clarification

[Warren F.]

Re: Can a 'line' be crossed w/ such devices?

Todd: I don't care what devices the judges use, there free to use whatever they might need to make a determination on a part of the car. If you have your Corvette judged, it still isn't going to be a complete judging of the car and getting a Flight certificate isn't going to mean diddly squat as far as correctness goes, if it isn't a complete judging process of the entire car. The NCRS does a reasonable job with the time and location they have to work with for the judging of the cars at the meets.

[Todd H 26112]

Re: Can a 'line' be crossed w/ such devices?

Thanks Warren, the first sentence did it nicely.

Just to clarify before other parties may infer too much from the question - it was ONLY about the use of devices exceeding the capabilities of the naked eye - NOT a question of how complete, correct or thorough the overall flight judging process is or is not nor what a judging award may or may not confer or imply.

[Warren F.]

Re: Can a 'line' be crossed w/ such devices?

Todd: You're welcome. I assumed since you seemed so concern about what extremes the judges might go to, in examining certain items on a Corvette, that I wanted to let you know that it matters very little in the overall scheme of judging the car when you don't take into account all the other items that need to be proper on a Corvette to come close to being as "factory built".

[Todd H 26112]

...and what about consistency?

Fair enough - thanks again Warren.

Perhaps another thing to keep in mind is consistency in judging when considering this. - or not - I dunno.

I think it can generally be presumed that all judges bring reasonable vision to the field beit corrected or not. We hope nobody is blind or vision impaired beyond a reasonably correctable state and leave it at that. Let's say the standard is a driver's license vision test and leave it at that?

But not all judges bring various optical devices like these. Maybe some do. Maybe everyone does. Maybe one is passed around. Maybe it varies in capabilities or power from others. Maybe there is none to be had at a given event.

And those that do, may not have the same 'power', 'magnification', resolution or quality of device. May be a cheap glass, an expensive lense, a camera or whatever.

Given these permutations in approachs to scrutinizing appearance like say the grain of a feaux wood panel or whatever subject matter - how does this reflect upon consistency on the field for a theoretically identical car from event to event?

Obviously we understand the same car, given such a complex judging system will never score identically for the same reasons over and over again. I'm just talking about those aspects of judging that may be impacted positively or negatively by such devices vs plain eyes. Is this a minimal or negligible difference if any or could an owner experience a more notable difference in judging outcome given the use of such devices or the use of eyes only?

Not implying anything - just asking...

[Rick A.]

Re: Can a 'line' be crossed w/ such devices?

Hey, Warren if the "certificate" didn't mean diddly squat, then why did you go through all of the effort to Top Flight!? Enquiring mind would like to know

[Dick W.]

Re: And that's after your Observer Judge

Loren, you must have seen me on the judging field with my white cane and dark glasses.

[Warren F.]

Re: Can a 'line' be crossed w/ such devices?

Rick: First off, there wasn't much of an effort, I took a correct Corvette to a meet and placed it on the field, it seems necessary to have it judged to be placed with other members cars at the meet. In the Sportsman class, you were parked off to the side of the events. I like the commaraderie of other NCRS members and mingling around all the cars. I really enjoy talking about all the nuances that these cars seem to have. In my opinion, if the Flight judging encompassed more thoroughness and completeness of each car, the certificate given would have more creditablity to it, thats all.

[Dennis C.]

Re: Why the presumption of an issue Dennis?

Todd - Go find happiness somewhere else, if you can... Your negative approach to life and the hobby holds nothing for me and I hope, few others. Bye, bye

[Todd H 26112]

Re: Why the presumption of an issue Dennis?

Todd - Go find happiness somewhere else, if you can... Your negative approach to life and the hobby holds nothing for me and I hope, few others. Bye, bye

Now let me get this straight: You respond to my original query laced w/ your brand of condescending arrogance. Now I can look past that kind of know-it-all haughtiness when good information is provided as a price we must pay w/ certain 'types' of people but unfortunately such was not the case here. You simplistically and unconstructively presume there to be an 'issue' when in fact there is none. Then you seem to fabricate an issue w/ baiting nastiness like commentary above. And after reading your posts elsewhere - the very idea you by comparison are a paragon of positivity to the hobby is a truly laughable suggestion. ...And I'm "negative"? Sure Dennis, sure. Pot, meet kettle. Kettle here's pot.

Now if you'd only made that invitation for me to leave a little nicer Dennis...? Oh well.