'65 Engine Pad - How will it judge?

[Chuck S.]

Re: '65 Engine Pad - How will it judge?

Gene, I agree with Bill. It's day stamp is not "T5" but "I'5". Check the "T" in "HT", the top bar is just slightly longer than the top bar on the "I". I don't know anything about midyear engine stamp fonts, but it appears genuine to me, and that the block "I" was used in this case.

The bottoms of the letters and stamps are not cut-off by the proximity of the stamp to the pad edge. It appears to me that the hammer impact was applied at an angle causing the tops of characters to be deep, and the bottom of the stamp to lift off the pad, resulting in the bottom of the characters being lightly stamped or not stamped at all.

[Joe C.]

Re: '65 Engine Pad - How will it judge?

Gene:

"T5" is actually "15" so, June 15th. I believe that capital "i", or "I" (which is not represented here the same as the engine stamp, but you know what I mean)was used to represent the numeral "1" . So the "T" that we read, is really an "I" with the bottom cut off, which represents a "1".
Give the guy a break, this looks like a real nice pad to me. Again, look at my first post in this thread. Notice how the deck and front lifter gallery seal flange are broached under the areas where the heads and manifold cover them. You wouldn't see these areas on an assembled engine, so no need for a counterfeiter to "broach" them.
Again, I am no expert, just stating the facts as I know them. I just do not see anything here which "condemns" this as a counterfeit.
I say this with all sincerity; if I have misstated facts, please educate me.

Joe

[Gregg Plapas]

Re: '65 Engine Pad - How will it judge?

I hope all, that have replied, will be at your judging. WHEW!!!!!!!!!!

GREGG

[Larry S.]

Re: It Seems To Me That No "Counterfeiter"........

Is there actually a difference between a couterfit,restamped,restored pad?
Is there such thing as a restored pad? or are they just kinder words for the same thing?

I have heard the term NFC at some shows before when I question it I was told Not Factory Correct is this also a kind word for the above word conterfit?

[Dick W.]

Re: It Seems To Me That No "Counterfeiter"........

To me there are distinct differences in the semantics. Counterfit is to make something it was not originally. Restamped to me is a catchall phrase. It could be on a block that had been "decked" with a rotary mill, putting numbers on a blank pad, etc. Restored pad means that. It is restored as it left GM. That is broach marks, assembly date and ID, and VIN. Nothing more or less. Typical factory production.

[Joe C.]

Re: '65 Engine Pad - How will it judge?

Dave:

Please forward that photo to Al Grenning, the undisputed wizard of engine pads. He will probably charge you a nominal "consultant" fee, but it would be interesting to see what his observations are. Emphasize to him that the block is broached on the hidden surfaces. I am willing to bet that your block shows broach marks on both deck surfaces, and both lifter valley seal flanges.
It appears that nobody on this board is willing to respond to my reasoning, so let's see what Mr.Grenning's viewpoint is.

Joe

P.S.: I am so goddam sorry that I used the word "counterfeit". Some of the good folks here chose to split hairs over semantics, rather than answer the question head on.

[Larry S.]

Re: It Seems To Me That No "Counterfeiter"........

AS QUOTED

I would venture an educated guess, that if the entire surfaces of the decks are broached, then there should be no question of originality.
Expert opinions?

Joe I am no expert but I will give my opinion anyways.

As far as I know the only way to copy a broach mark is with the heads off.Just because the broach marks run the lenght of the block does not authenticate originality.

I am making NO observation on the pictures mentioned I do not have the knowledge to comment on them.

[Dave McDufford]