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Re: 1965 Restoration Dilemma
I wouldn't change anything you have already done. If you are building the car to drive and suit you, I would leave it that way. You can still have it judged and see where you stand. Be happy with all the compliments you'll receivce even if it doesn't Top Flight. -
Re: 1965 Restoration Dilemma
I could not agree more that that response. What you are striving to accomplish with your car sounds like where my head was back in 1975 when I joined NCRS. The information that the people that are a part of this organization should be used to only help you fufill YOUR goals with the car. The friends you make along the way are just "icing on the cake". Please don't get hung up on trying to make the car so "correct" that you will be afraid to drive it.Comment
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Re: 1965 Restoration Dilemma
With you having the original 327/350 engine for your 65 and considering using the LT-1 solid lifter 350/370 HP cam, are you going to retain 11-1 compression ratio that was used?
Having a original owner original 327/350HP L79, I like the idle sound of this engine. Years ago I put a L-79 cam in my brothers 327 with lower compression than what the real L-79 had and it just did not sound the same. His 327 also had different heads. It takes the total package to make the sound.Comment
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Re: 1965 Restoration Dilemma
Dave, your 65 sounds like a nice car. I have approached my resto pretty much the same except I'm putting lacquer paint on it and I can do that myself. I painted some suspension parts that are supposed to be bare because I live on the Gulf Coast and despise rust. A bare part here will rust overnight in some cases. I also do not plan to sloppily spray blackout underneath the hood and I refuse to paint my beautiful exhaust manifolds or let them get rusty. I know some are thinking that it's blasphemy to over restore a Corvette but it's my car and like Ricky Nelson said "you can't please everyone, so you gotta please yourself". If I decide to go the judging route, a Second Flight would be fine with me.
IMO having a beautiful Corvette and not driving it is like being married to a beautiful supermodel and being celibate. Of course there are a couple of exceptions for some midyears whose value is well into the 6 figure range and would be irreplacable.
BLComment
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Re: 1965 Restoration Dilemma
Dave,
People with your desires and dreams for a nice Corvette that can be enjoyed should be the backbone of any automobile club. Your Vette should and will be appreciated by everyone that attends that chapter meet. All who attends the meet will want to be in your shoes and enjoy their Corvette like you are enjoying yours. Screw the points--it's your Vette.
As for the cam, I would advise against putting a solid cam in any driver Corvette because of the maintenance. You will have to use poly-locks and I would recommend screw in studs. The solid cams have to be adjusted as they wear. The hydraulic lifters take up the adjustment as time goes by and save you all the problems. Use the 327/350HP hydraulic and you'll have a much better running engine with less maintenance problems. It will sound just fine with off the road exhaust or side pipes.
Have a great time with your 65.
JRComment
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Re: 1965 Restoration Dilemma
Dave:
The LT1 cam will sound very different than the correct "151" cam that belongs in your L79. I don't believe that it will be an issue in Flight Judging. It will definately be an issue in PV judging, and will probably be an immediate disqualification. IMHO, the L79 is a nice, all around engine, and I would build it with the "151" cam.
When I rebuilt my L76 engine, I installed the original type "30-30". It is a Federal Mogul, Sealed Power camshaft. If you adjust it per the Hinckely/Williams method, you will really wake it up.
The L76/L84 engine is a bit short on torque, but screams on the top end. I love it. It is quirky, and not very easy to drive sometimes ( better if you keep the R's up).
JoeComment
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Re: 1965 Restoration Dilemma
The important thing is to restore the car to the standards you choose that will maximize your enjoyment of the finished product. If your primary objective is to achieve the highest NCRS awards then you should restore it using the judging guide as your primary plan.
I have my own plan and don't plan to have my SWC judged. As the original owner with a file full of original factory documentation I know what I have and can prove it, but I don't like rusty fasteners and exhaust systems. Everything underneath is painted or plated, but I will finish it in the original Riverside Red acrylic lacquer. The durability of lacquer versus the modern more durable finishes isn't an issue with the type of service the car will see in my lifetime.
My philosoply is to restore it to factory original spec, but as if the factory had all the time in the world to make it "perfect" and last a lifetime - no body construction flaws that show through the paint and tight, consistent panel gaps with all surfaces blending in along the same contour lines along with NO uncoated parts that will develop surface rust - what is generally known as "over restoration". I lived with all the flaws during its first life. For its second life, I want it "perfect".
Regarding solid lifter cams, I can adjust the valves with normal hand tools in less time than it take to do a good wash and detail. Being as how I own three DOHC powered vehicles with shim over bucket adjustment, I have to have a shim collection and special tool(s) for each engine. By comparison, checking and adjusting the valve lash on a Corvette every 12K miles (GM's recommended interval) is a no-brainer. It's just part of a normal "tune-up" that includes inspecting and replacing, as required, the points and plugs, inspecting the secondary ignition components and adjusting the carburetor. I consider all this to be part of the vintage car experience.
As stated a LT-1 cam might make it through Flight judging, especially if you lash the valves according to the Hinckely/Williams paper, which will result in nearly undetectable lifter clatter, but a good PV judge should be able to detect it, which is an automatic failure, so don't set a Duntov award as an objective and install the LT-1 cam. The LT-1 cam does not need anything other than generic OE valve train components. GM mechannical lifter cams have very "soft action" and don't need screw in studs. If your engine has no history of pulled studs, leave 'em alone, they'll work fine.
The LT-1 cam, if anything, will have less tendency to detonate with a 11:1 CR than the L-79 cam because the LT-1 cam's lower dynamic compression ratio due to its greater overlap will reduce actual compression pressure at low/medium revs, which is where the engine has the greatest tendency to detonate. Most SHP/FI small blocks will run on unleaded pump premium with, at most, some juggling of the initial and centrifugal advance curve. During disassembly all the measurements should be taken to determine total combustion chamber volume, then actual compression ratio can be computed using compressed gasket thickness. Assuming the block and heads are not cut and are at nominal Flint dimensions and if a compostion gasket is used the actual CR will usually come in at about 10.5:1, which will work okay with any of the GM high overlap SHP cams.
DukeComment
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About the engine...
The 327/350 is a real nice runner under any circumstance, at stoplights or highway. The sound depends a great deal on the exact internal configuration of the exhaust system. As for the LT1 cam, worry more about the power curve you really want. I have the Duntov cam in mine, and just the other day I was thinking there was a tiny tap and I should put cam adjustment on my spring list. The last time I adjusted the cam was in 1989. Remember, cam adjustment is a factor of mileage. Unless the car is a daily commuter, well, I used to drive a '66 Mustang 289HP as a daily driver. I reset the valves every other oil change (more often than spec) and I could do it in about an hour. This worked out to, at most, twice a year on a daily driver!Comment
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Re: 1965 Restoration Dilemma
Dave,
Another consideration in your cam choice should be what your running for gears. My current car is a 67 L79 with close ratio 4 speed and 3:70 rear. It is a real nice cruiser and unless you have a wide ratio tranny I personally wouldn't want rear gears of less than 3:55 if you went with the LT-1 cam. My previous Corvette was a 70 LT-1 with close ratio and 4:11 rear. For highway driving I would have liked 3:70. The L79 cam is a good midrange cam but runs out of wind where the LT-1 keeps coming. If you like RPMs go with the LT-1 if you have the right gears, otherwise I'd keep it stock.
WayneComment
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A couple of comments...
Nice sound but weak below 2000. What you really need is about 10.5:1 compression, and the 327/350 hp hyd cam, with Roads lifters. I have used this in cars and boats, resulting in stump-pulling torque from idle up, and fast-lane passing on the freeway. Get the "sound" from careful choice of exhaust system.
With the 3.36 rear, stick with the wide ratio trans. If you switch to a 3.55 rear you'll still get away with it, but I'd recommend if you go to a 3.55, 3.90, or 4.11 rear, change to a close ratio. Now you've spent some serious cash. spend your money on the first paragraph instead, which will cost less the the rear swap alone and totally change the feel and sound of the car. Later, if you just gotta go with the 4.11/close ratio, fine. Just remeber to take your ear plugs on road trips, 'cause 3000 rpm on the road gets old fast.Comment
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