'64 PB Master Cylinder Date Coding - NCRS Discussion Boards

'64 PB Master Cylinder Date Coding

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  • Joe L.
    Beyond Control Poster
    • February 1, 1988
    • 43193

    #16
    Re: '64 PB Master Cylinder Date Coding

    James-----

    The VAST majority of Delco brake part castings that I've examined seem to have only the 3 digit "date" code that you're referring to, if they have anything, at all, that resembles a date code. I've never been able to determine if this series actually represents a date code (julian-style) or whether it refers to something else. In any event, assuming that it is a julian-style date code, I've observed MANY pieces that absolutely, positively didn't have anything that could be interpretted as a "year" coding. This includes 65-82 brake calipers (I've examined MANY hundreds) and 67-82 master cylinders (a hundred or more, too). So, it's apparent to me that if these 3 digit series are julian date coding, then, for whatever reason, there was no year coding included on the casting. That makes the 3 digit coding pretty much useless as far as determining "correctness" is concerned. Given, in combination, the "6 month rule" and the lack of a year coding that means that 50% of the castings out there would be "correct" for any car.

    It's possible that the "2" or "3" seen below the 3 digit code is a reference to a year. However, it's also possible that it refers to something else. One possibility would be a mold number and there are many other possibilities, too. In any event and as I say, based upon my observations of other Delco brake part castings, there usually isn't anything that could be interpretted as a year coding. IF there is a STAMPED coding on a cast iron brake part, that coding usually does include a year. However, these stamped codings are the exception rather than the rule for Delco brake part castings.

    The vast majority of these pre-1973 Delco cast iron brake part castings were produced at the old GM Central Foundry Danville, IL nodular cast iron foundry. Perhaps if we could find someone out there that worked there AND was familiar with their casting mark protocols we could help get to the bottom of all this.
    In Appreciation of John Hinckley

    Comment

    • Joe L.
      Beyond Control Poster
      • February 1, 1988
      • 43193

      #17
      Re: '64 PB Master Cylinder Date Coding

      Philip-----

      "5464264" IS a part number. It's a Delco-Moraine part number for a raw casting. Of course, that part was NEVER sold as a FINISHED PART through GMSPO nor was it ever used as a finished part at a vehicle assembly plant. It was, however, used as one of a large number of components at the Delco-Moraine manufacturing plants in Dayton, OH to produced FINISHED assemblies. As you say, these finished assemblies usually nowhere carried the finished assembly part number assigned to them. That number could be only be found on the racks of these assemblies delivered to vehicle assembly plants or to GMSPO. At the assembly plants, a "broadcast code" sticker or tag was used to "identify" the assembly for vehicle assembly purposes. GMSPO removed the assemblies from the racks, packaged them in boxes and put the number on the boxes that SERVICE assemblies were packaged in. Usually, neither the "broadcast code" labels nor the SERVICE part box is still with the master cylinder when most folks get their hands on one these days.

      Also as you say, it's very possible that a particular raw casting was used for more than one finished master cylinder assembly. It's also very possible that the casting was machined differently for different applications----it's not necessarily just a matter of different internal components being used to build up different master cylinders which could later be "converted" to other configurations.
      In Appreciation of John Hinckley

      Comment

      • Philip Whitaker Member #2024

        #18
        Re: '64 PB Master Cylinder Date Coding

        Joe,

        Thanks for the information on the 'casting number' as refrence to it being a part number. My Chevrolet parts manual, which is dated 'revised March 1, 1964', shows the 7/8 diameter bore Moraine unit as being the sevice replacement for 63 passenger cars with production power brakes or metalic linings; 64 passenger cars with metalic brakes except power brakes; and 63-64 Corvettes except special high performance. The part number is 5464275.

        That's why I see so many of these master cylinders on 1963 Corvettes that are for sale on ebay. Apperantly this same master cylinder is a direct replacemnt for the thumb screw unit found on 63 Corvettes.

        I believe this same casting is used to produce a M/C with a 1" bore, and I have seen them for sale on ebay as being correct for 64 Corvettes (which they are not). The difference being that the casting is embossed on the exterior with either a 1" or 7/8" to designate the bore diameter.

        Also when the casting is used for power brakes, they machine the casting for a 'bleeder'.

        I said I believe that the number, under what I've heard is the Julian date, is the year because I've only ever observed a 2, 3, or 4. These numbers would correspond with the same years that these units were being cast. Perhaps a coincidence.

        Maybe we'll get lucky and someone who knows for sure will jump in here. The JM is definatly wrong. Most judges only have the JM to go by, so I don't have a clue as to how they are judging these on the field.

        Phil

        Comment

        • James W.
          Extremely Frequent Poster
          • December 1, 1990
          • 2640

          #19
          Re: '64 PB Master Cylinder Date Coding

          Joe,

          Do you thing that the number 2 found below the 189 number could possibly be the 2nd shift of production in a given day?

          Just a thought and thanks for your input. I am bidding on the master cylinder with about 10 hours to go. We'll see what happens.

          Regards,

          James West

          Comment

          • Joe L.
            Beyond Control Poster
            • February 1, 1988
            • 43193

            #20
            Re: '64 PB Master Cylinder Date Coding

            James-----

            The "2" could mean a LOT of things other than "1962".
            In Appreciation of John Hinckley

            Comment

            • Scott Butville

              #21
              Re: '64 PB Master Cylinder Date Coding

              If no one can say they ever saw a casting with a 1 (which would be first shift) and they have been seen with a 4 (no such thing as fourth shift)it's not likely that 2 means second shift.

              Comment

              • Joe L.
                Beyond Control Poster
                • February 1, 1988
                • 43193

                #22
                Re: '64 PB Master Cylinder Date Coding

                Scott-----

                I agree; if a "4" has been seen then it means that this character does not represent a shift designation. So, that eliminates ONE of the many possibilities.
                In Appreciation of John Hinckley

                Comment

                • Scott Butville

                  #23
                  Re: '64 PB Master Cylinder Date Coding

                  Philip, There is a 264 master cylinder on e-bay (item #7900754098) as I write this with an excellent picture of the numbers on the bottom. The number other than the Julian date (the numbers between the screws)seems to be a "1". Interestingly, it is not under the date, but next to it.

                  Comment

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