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In conjunction with a caliper rebuild (by VB&P) I am preparing to install new front bearings in my 76 as they had been over tightened and showed signs of deterioration. I noticed a blue "sealant" around the metal to metal contacts of the seals when I removed them. Is a sealant normally used here? Also, when pressing in the new races is anti-seize recommended or any other lube or compound on the hub to race contacts? Finally, what methods are recommended for refinishing the hub? There is a little surface rust... should they be painted and how should they be prepped? As always, thanks for your time.
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1977 L-82 M-21 Two-Time Top Flight
1976 L-48 M-38 nothing is correct
1973 Triumph Bonneville 750 T140V -
Re: C-3 front hub work
Mike, I started to write you a long response on how to do this, but I don't want to insult your intelligence if you already know how to replace bearing races. I recommend reading the Chassis Service Manual on installation and adjustment.
The direct answers to your questions are that no anti-seize or other "compounds" are required to install either the bearing races or the inner seals; these components have a light press fit and there is no requirement for any sealants or anti-seize. I would clean the hub interior surgically clean with solvent, and lightly oil the outside diameter of the race and the hub opening before installing the bearing races. Nothing is required on the inner seals.
Finish will depend on your future plans. On factory fresh cars, the rotors were raw cast iron. If you are having the car judged by NCRS, you have to decide to have rust or to take the point deduct for painted rotors. If it's a driver, I would paint the rotors with stainless steel paint...some swear by cast blast...your choice.
Prep the rotors by first degreasing and cleaning the hub interior thoroughly using mineral spirits, then seal the hub openings and mask the rotor braking surfaces with masking tape, and bead-blast the rotors to remove all rust. Thoroughly re-clean the hub interior (surgically clean ), re-mask the hub openings and brake surfaces, and paint the rotors complete. Then install the bearing races (described above), inner bearing, and innerseal.
Install the rotor on the spindle and adjust per the CSM. -
Re: C-3 front hub work
Mike, I started to write you a long response on how to do this, but I don't want to insult your intelligence if you already know how to replace bearing races. I recommend reading the Chassis Service Manual on installation and adjustment.
The direct answers to your questions are that no anti-seize or other "compounds" are required to install either the bearing races or the inner seals; these components have a light press fit and there is no requirement for any sealants or anti-seize. I would clean the hub interior surgically clean with solvent, and lightly oil the outside diameter of the race and the hub opening before installing the bearing races. Nothing is required on the inner seals.
Finish will depend on your future plans. On factory fresh cars, the rotors were raw cast iron. If you are having the car judged by NCRS, you have to decide to have rust or to take the point deduct for painted rotors. If it's a driver, I would paint the rotors with stainless steel paint...some swear by cast blast...your choice.
Prep the rotors by first degreasing and cleaning the hub interior thoroughly using mineral spirits, then seal the hub openings and mask the rotor braking surfaces with masking tape, and bead-blast the rotors to remove all rust. Thoroughly re-clean the hub interior (surgically clean ), re-mask the hub openings and brake surfaces, and paint the rotors complete. Then install the bearing races (described above), inner bearing, and innerseal.
Install the rotor on the spindle and adjust per the CSM.Comment
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Addendum: C-3 front hub work
Mike, I should have remembered to point out that any paint used on the hub/rotor will need to be rated for high temperature. This is going to limit your color choices, since most general-use automotive paints are good to about 250 deg. VHT has brake paints (good to 1500 deg) in cast aluminum or black, which may be suitable for a driver (non-original...your choice), but their high temperature clear may be best for original appearance.Comment
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Addendum: C-3 front hub work
Mike, I should have remembered to point out that any paint used on the hub/rotor will need to be rated for high temperature. This is going to limit your color choices, since most general-use automotive paints are good to about 250 deg. VHT has brake paints (good to 1500 deg) in cast aluminum or black, which may be suitable for a driver (non-original...your choice), but their high temperature clear may be best for original appearance.Comment
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Re: Addendum: C-3 front hub work
Chuck, thanks for your reply! I like detail so it is not likely that you would have offended me. As a teenager I would just hammer them in as squarely as possible, now I want to do it as well as possible. I have the CSM and the supplement but they don't give a lot of detail with respect to the process. You've given me most of what I was looking for. Any subtle points you might have mentioned but didn't would be most welcome. Seems like after I passed 40 I started to realize I didn't know as much as I thought. Thanks again.1977 L-82 M-21 Two-Time Top Flight
1976 L-48 M-38 nothing is correct
1973 Triumph Bonneville 750 T140VComment
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Re: Addendum: C-3 front hub work
Chuck, thanks for your reply! I like detail so it is not likely that you would have offended me. As a teenager I would just hammer them in as squarely as possible, now I want to do it as well as possible. I have the CSM and the supplement but they don't give a lot of detail with respect to the process. You've given me most of what I was looking for. Any subtle points you might have mentioned but didn't would be most welcome. Seems like after I passed 40 I started to realize I didn't know as much as I thought. Thanks again.1977 L-82 M-21 Two-Time Top Flight
1976 L-48 M-38 nothing is correct
1973 Triumph Bonneville 750 T140VComment
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Re: Addendum: C-3 front hub work
"I would just hammer them in as squarely as possible..."
One of the things I was going to say is, don't get the race cocked in the bore. It's a little tricky starting the race in the bore; be patient and don't be over-zealous in your "hammering". Once the race is started, a "driver" is the probably the best tool for installation. You mentioned "pressing" them in; personally, I would not use a press...things go too far wrong too quickly.
Adjustment: Torque the spindle nut firmly (12 ft-lbs) while rotating wheel to displace excess grease. Back off the spindle nut at least one flat to the first available cotter pin hole (spindles drilled at two angles). Insert cotter pin to hold nut in position, and spin wheel to insure it turns without resistance. Bearings should have ZERO preload (nut not even hand tight), and almost imperceptible endplay along spindle axis (0.001-0.008" allowable). I don't like feeling ANY endplay; if I can feel it, then it's probably on the high end of allowable or more. But, do not cheat on backing off the nut a full flat, or your bearings could be blue (again).Comment
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Re: Addendum: C-3 front hub work
"I would just hammer them in as squarely as possible..."
One of the things I was going to say is, don't get the race cocked in the bore. It's a little tricky starting the race in the bore; be patient and don't be over-zealous in your "hammering". Once the race is started, a "driver" is the probably the best tool for installation. You mentioned "pressing" them in; personally, I would not use a press...things go too far wrong too quickly.
Adjustment: Torque the spindle nut firmly (12 ft-lbs) while rotating wheel to displace excess grease. Back off the spindle nut at least one flat to the first available cotter pin hole (spindles drilled at two angles). Insert cotter pin to hold nut in position, and spin wheel to insure it turns without resistance. Bearings should have ZERO preload (nut not even hand tight), and almost imperceptible endplay along spindle axis (0.001-0.008" allowable). I don't like feeling ANY endplay; if I can feel it, then it's probably on the high end of allowable or more. But, do not cheat on backing off the nut a full flat, or your bearings could be blue (again).Comment
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Re: C-3 front hub work
If you use a brass punch to drive the races in, be careful because they like to flake off little pieces of brass. It is possible to get a chunk behind the race before it seats causing problems with seating and worse problems later on down the road.
Spin the wheel or hub as you tighten it the first time to get the grease out of the way. As already posted, you can use a flexable torque wrench to preload the bearings as you spin the hub or wheel.
Use a brake cleaner on the disk brake surface if you get grease or oil on it. Keep the paint away from the metal surfaces and the area under the lug nuts. Its an add risk because it can compress and deteriorate and eventually allow the wheel to loosen. Seen it happen a couple of times to the same guy. He insisted on having pretty brake drums and hubs. Just my two cents worth.
It sounds like there may have been problems with that wheel bearing it the past (can't recall the original post). Look at that spindle real closely. Surface should be perfect, no grooves, no gaulding.
The service manual goes into pretty good detail on this stuff. Later, TerryComment
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Re: C-3 front hub work
If you use a brass punch to drive the races in, be careful because they like to flake off little pieces of brass. It is possible to get a chunk behind the race before it seats causing problems with seating and worse problems later on down the road.
Spin the wheel or hub as you tighten it the first time to get the grease out of the way. As already posted, you can use a flexable torque wrench to preload the bearings as you spin the hub or wheel.
Use a brake cleaner on the disk brake surface if you get grease or oil on it. Keep the paint away from the metal surfaces and the area under the lug nuts. Its an add risk because it can compress and deteriorate and eventually allow the wheel to loosen. Seen it happen a couple of times to the same guy. He insisted on having pretty brake drums and hubs. Just my two cents worth.
It sounds like there may have been problems with that wheel bearing it the past (can't recall the original post). Look at that spindle real closely. Surface should be perfect, no grooves, no gaulding.
The service manual goes into pretty good detail on this stuff. Later, TerryComment
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Re: I'm not oppsed to pressing
You just need to be aware of your surroundings that's all.
1) Make sure that the race is setting relativley square to the bore of the hub.
2) You can use a heavy piece of true flat stock and then a large socket that l matches the outside diameter of the race walls.
3) Place slow press pressure until the race starts in. It should not take much pressure at all to get it started.
4) Once it starts, it will travel straight and true until it either bottoms out or you swap the socket for the flat stock to finish it off.
If it appears to be binding and not starting, you will need to back off pressure and take a hard look at the alignment of the race as it sets on the hub.
I usually take a fine file and just barely (and I mean barely) nick off the front inner edge off the hub to help race get started.
No biggie
ChuckComment
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Re: I'm not oppsed to pressing
You just need to be aware of your surroundings that's all.
1) Make sure that the race is setting relativley square to the bore of the hub.
2) You can use a heavy piece of true flat stock and then a large socket that l matches the outside diameter of the race walls.
3) Place slow press pressure until the race starts in. It should not take much pressure at all to get it started.
4) Once it starts, it will travel straight and true until it either bottoms out or you swap the socket for the flat stock to finish it off.
If it appears to be binding and not starting, you will need to back off pressure and take a hard look at the alignment of the race as it sets on the hub.
I usually take a fine file and just barely (and I mean barely) nick off the front inner edge off the hub to help race get started.
No biggie
ChuckComment
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