Unrestored C1 Flight Winrs Advice

[Debra P.]

Hi Boys & Girls, long one, sorry.
I need some advise from Flight winners of unrestored C-1s. My car is a 3 Star award car in year 2000, it hasen't been judged, as far as I know since then. I bought this car in September 2004, it's a 1958 283 with 2x4s. I have replaced the exhaust/mufflers (OVAL), correct aluminized from Corvette Central. My mechanic used all the original hangers & brackets. I also replaced the radiator, it needs to be painted as the proper water pump, it will be painted as well. I ordered the correct tag's stickers & decals that are almost gone on most engine parts. I was lucky on Ebay & got a Non-vented gas cap, I will remove my Coker Radials & put back my B.F. Bias w/spinner caps. New Delco, but I didn't get the dirty tar top, I went with the treated top & will take I was told, a 6 point deduction. Spark plugs & correct radio wires/with F boots, dist cap, points, rotor, condenser all as stated in the manual. My top guy will fix the stiching on my soft top, it's really in great shape & he will attach outer tag, it still has the mohair covered weather stripping. He will also put the heal pad on the rug that was missing. I will then have it detailed as not to remove all the GM inspector marks. I will make the car as clean as she can get. But one NCRS member said that I wasn't going for a "Bloomington Survivor" the car already won that award. He said the car must be like it came out of the showroom to Top Flight. I do not want to take away her beautiful unrestored status. People have already taken pics of my car to help with their restorations. I bought 58 seats & restored those because the originals are to delicate to use. I drive my car alot. The seat bottoms didn't come out correct, I sent them back, I hope Al gets them back to me in time. Do I have the car judged with the new backs & the old bottoms ? I have the original trunk mat, it has a 4 inch tear, do I use that one or the new correct dated mat ? I am confused, is it not possible for me to Top Flight with this car, it runs like new, even my mechanic was impressed. Any & all comments appreciated. Thank you everyone from the past who has been following my posts & emailing me with advise, you have been great support.
Sincerly,
Deb

[Gene B.]

Re: Unrestored C1 Flight Winrs Advice

A lot depends on the judge. I have judged 53-55 at the national, however I own a 58, 2x4 245 HP, vin 3741.

I can tell you from my standpoint, I would use as many original parts as possible. I would give you credit for an original part and be lenient onthe condition, than I would for a repo part. I would use the original trunk mat. I am sure there are many judges who have never seen an original mat. Event hough you say your repo mat is properly dated, the 58 in a circle probably does not have the dots around the circle, or at least not as it appeared on the original. The tear to me woud be very minor deduction, maybe a point, or just noted due to the originality of the mat.

If you do not get the seats back in time, then have it judged the way you have it. I wouldn't hold back the car for that reason.

If you have a judging manual, judge the car yourself, and go through the judging sheet.

I can tell you that unfortunately more 59 & 60 cars have been judged than 58s. There are many unique items to the 58 that some judges are not aware. Subtle things that you need to defend. In my case the judge thought I had major front end work becasue of the stabilizer under the fenders. Many judges think the seat belt webbing should be interior color, rather than steel blue, unless you car was built after april 1958. Things like that you need to be prepared foras you go through the judging process. I had to provide pictures of the weather stripping joint in the trunk. They manual says it should have a 1/4' gap to allow for air to release as you close the trunk. My original weatherstrip was tight. I had picture to prove it. I also had the original "Diamond S" logos on it. Many judges have never seen the real weatherstrip. On your exhaust system, I used a rag dipped in high temp black paint and just run over the surface of the aluminized exhaust. This way no-one could tell it was aluminized. Make sure your exhasut manifold locks are steel and not stainless. Little things like this can help.

Based on your previous posts, I would think your car should get a top flight. Personally I would rather see an unrestored car than a body off restored car. Mine needed restoration in the worst way, so I had no choice.

Hope this helps.

Gene

[John H.]

Re: Unrestored C1 Flight Winrs Advice

Deb -

Not all Top Flight cars are "perfect" in every detail; you can accumulate up to 270 point deductions and still Top Flight the car. The "percentage score" isn't on the Top Flight certificate - can be anywhere from 94% (of 4500) to 100%, and it's still Top Flight, and only you will know the net score. Make sure you focus on Operations items, as most are 20-25 points and can kill your score in a hurry if you have one or two that don't work; it takes a LOT of onesy-twosey deductions to add up to ONE Operations item that doesn't work. Good luck!

[Debra P.]

Re: Unrestored C1 Flight Winrs Advice

Gene, Thank you so much. I ran into the garage & I wish you were my judge. The condition of my weather stripping is mint & the diamond with the S is mint. The gap looks a little less than 1/4, but I will measure it. See; another guy told me not to use my mat. Once I clean it, WOW, I keep it in the flat cardboard that the repo came in, in my office & it has the dots. Prior judges did note on the last Top flight win, "NICE S" logo. I hope it Top flights Gene. I can't wait to take it to Utah, for the PV, I know she can win, this car purrs. When you tell your mechanic to take his whip when he test drives your car & he calls you at home & says "I'm Impressed" ! I was so excited. I hope some more guys chime in with you & give me this valuable info. Soo, C'mon you guys, I know you all have some tid bits to share like Gene. I wish you could see the window on my soft top & the mohair in the compartment with a little yellow glue streaks, not to mention the weather stripping. It's almost like new.No leaks either.Tap the key & let go, starts right up.
NCRS people are the best,
Deb

[William C.]

Re: Unrestored C1 Flight Winrs Advice

Let it be, I have top flighted a few unrestored cars, some with driving points, some not. It is not as high a hurdle as you might think, especially, as John says if you get the OPS correct. One or two ops failures will cost you more than a dozen small items on condition.

[Roy B.]

Re: Unrestored C1 Flight Winrs Advice

Your getting your self hipper over a top flight?? gee whiz!! it's only a piece of paper , just do what makes you feel good showing your Corvette. Not to say that the advice your getting is wrong , but your taking it back home with you not some one els . Don't let peer pressure under judging disappoint you no matter what you get, Just realize what you have may be a Corvette that many others wish they had.
I like the fact that you drive it as I also drive mine.
I don't mean to make such a broad statement BUT few trailer Corvette with all there awards get to enjoy their vett as we do by driving them. The difference in resale value to me is worth what ever the amount is ( a restored Corvette CAN BE restored again you know). To many Corvettes with all their awards never see the road again,( WHY MONEY) so that is one less Corvette to be enjoyed by some one ( which makes a driver more That's how I see it and that's why I need none of the top dollar awards.
Now that's just ME , so don't throw rocks.

[Richard B.]

Unrestored C-1

Deb,

All good advise above. You can get a Judging Guide, and the score sheets for your car now, but the best thing is to take your car to a Chapter Meet, and present it for Judging. You will finish the day saying: "So, that's how this works!" You may get a Top Flight, Third Flight, or just the thanks of the members for bringing your car out for everyone to look at. But you will learn more than you can imagine from the process.

You will learn from the Judges as they inspect your car, from seeing other cars, and talking with other owners. And when you get your score sheets back, you will have a base evaluation to possibly build on for your next meet.

And I think it was good advise to make sure everything works. The 1-2 point items will not likely make any difference at all. So... go out and show your car, enjoy it, drive it, and regardless of what Flight level you get, remember you are driving a CORVETTE!!!

Regards,

Rich Beauchamp.....

[Kent K.]

Re: Unrestored C-1

Deb,
They're only ORIGINAl once ... Leave it alone!!! Keep it original so others may learn from your example. Unfortunately for me, the Bow-Tie judging process began shortly after I disassembled my '67 and started restoring the pieces. Had I waited a just few weeks since there was wind of the Bow-Tie Judging, I could have saved numerous frog skins and presented another learning tool for the masses. But, that's just MHO (my humble opinion).
Kent #6201

[John R.]

Re: Unrestored C1 Flight Winrs Advice

Deb ---

I anticipate that I will be judging C-2's at our chapter meet but am really looking forward to seeing your 58. The advice you received to your post is all good. I would rather see an original part over a reproduction and would urge you to leave well enough alone, at least until after your car is judged.

[Gene B.]

Re: Unrestored C1 Flight Winrs Advice

Deb something else. Carry extra fuses and maybe a turn signal light for each the front and rear. Also carry an extra flasher. The previous comments about the ops check is correct. 25 points on a light bulb being out can hit very hard. It would be a shame if you blow a fuse, just prior to ops check and sustain a 25 deduct.

Check all of the operation items prior to the ops check. They will check your interior light on the dash, whether the headlight switch will dim the interior dash lights, the heater blower operates at both speeds, does air blow from the heater and then out of the defroster vents. do both speeds of the wipers work and do they park it the correct postion. If you have windshield washer, make sure it has fluid in it. The door locks have to work in various position and turnuing the key forward locks the door and turning it back unlocks the doors. Make sure your cold idle works. The radio preset station button needs to go to a preset station and then be able to reset to another preset atation. THe wonderbar needs to seek a signal. Rememer to raise your attenna to get better reception. Theese are jsut a couple of things you should know.

If you have never gone through this before it can be nerve racking, but...

Remember Roy's Comments: It is just a peice of paper. It is your car and enjoy it for that. Remember all judges are not the same. Some have a lot of knowledge and want to impress you with their knowledge, others will have more knowledge and will appreciate the car for its historic information and will make you feel good about the car.

Just remember to have fun and not to get too wrapped up in the judging process.

[Kevin T.]

Re: Unrestored C1 Flight Winrs Advice

Debra:

Irrespective of any awards you have or may achieve, it sounds like you have a beautiful car. Most importantly in my mind, you are able to reliably enjoy driving and sharing it with other enthusiasts. I am hoping for the same with my 59 fuelie, and I am looking forward to the spring here in Chicago so I can take it out regularly.

Having said that, don't forget to get an NCRS windshield decal, fire extinguisher, and battery cutoff switch. I understand that there are some easy bonus points you can get towards Top Flight with those items.

Regards, - Kevin