rebuild or crate??

[Werner R.]

i need some advice. i have a 64 driver. the prior owner put in a made up BB. i don't know the internals, but it is probably supposed to be somewhat of an L-72 car. well, i need to pull the engine to deal with a rod bearing problem. the timing chain is sloppy and who knows what else. however, the compression is strong and even. i am debating having a rebuild done. i havn't priced it out yet, but i see the number 3K tossed around the board.
since it is not an original engine anyway, i am not obsessed with it. i was thinking of putting in a crate motor. how about a 383 from gm; a 350. any thoughts??
i have the car in the country and my driving is mostly back roads, small towns and some freeway. no strips, racing etc. help, some advice please. the car has a 3.70 rear end with an M-21. i currently run headers and side pipes and love the look.
werner

[Clare Carpenter]

Re: rebuild or crate??

Some would say there is no substitute for cubic inches but since your car isn't a big block car anyway I'd go with a real nice small block instead. Less weight, better handling and stopping, probably better mileage though likely not a motivating factor here, and cheaper all around. You could likely sell your BB setup for a good price and offset the cost of a new complete small block. I haven't riden in or owned a 383 but I have seen a couple run on the chassis dyno and they can be very potent. Lots of torque and could offer the best of both worlds for your application. IMHO.

[Chuck S.]

Re: rebuild or crate??

I would rebuild the big block.

It's a driver, so going to an original looking small block is not important in my mind. A big block in a 64 is unique and there is no doubt that makes the car more marketable than with any non-original small block, except maybe with a complete engine dated to the car.

The car has already been modified to accept the big block; to change back probably means additional work to undo the big block modification, say front spring replacement. Anyway, having a big block in the car is like money in your savings account drawing interest...big block engines (in/out of cars) are at a premium and are not getting any cheaper.

[Dave F.]

I'm with Chuck on this one...

Unless you are going to restore it, stay with the big block for all the reasons Chuck stated. Downside is building a big block costs a wee bit more than a small block, but it's a RAT....not a mouse.

[Chuck R.]

Re: rebuild or crate??

Hi Werner,

I would do the math either way and weigh out what you will be into $$ wise either way. Of course that means getting the BB out and into a shop to have it gone through to get a clear rebuild picture.

As already stated by Chuck S., your going to additionally be into suspension mods. from front to back plus whatever you'll need to change out under the hood if you go the SB route.

Do you enjoy the car with the BB? That may just be the other deciding factor.

Good luck with your decision,

Chuck R.

[Werner R.]

Re: rebuild or crate??

interesting responses; not what i expected. i hope to get more viewpoints. thanks again to one and all. i did not think having a BB in a 64 was a good thing to do rather than having an SB IF BOTH WERE NOM. i'll have to think about this. the reason i like the BB is because i have been tinkering with it for 6 years and have parts and experience etc. i don't really want to start with an SB unless it is a good idea for torquey performance reasons as a turnkey DRIVER. the BB has been fine.
werner

[Jeremy D.]

Ok, I'll argue...

I'd use that big block as a doorstop and look into the ZZ383 motor from GM. You'd have a brand new motor built by the General that is smaller, lighter, has aluminum heads, will probably run cooler, and if your car was originally a small block it'll drop in no problem. If 425 hp and a ton of torque in a now-lighter car ain't enough to make you happy, you can go as nuts as you want to. I am sure that for the money you would spend remachining and rebuilding the BB, you could stuff that brand new motor in and maybe even buy a manifold for it. It would be a little more $$ in the end (induction,headers,etc) but I think the results would be WELL worth it.

[Werner R.]

Re: Ok, I'll argue...

jeremy
that's what my wife thinks. if the cost is not that different, why not opt for a brand new motor, especially if gives good performance for my needs ie a responsive farm country based driver. any idea as to the cost of the crate zz383 as shipped and as to the specs as shipped, without mods [other than headers and pipes]??
thanks werner

[Clare Carpenter]

and I'll agree....

Werner, I agree with Jeremy. The ZZ383 puts out 425hp @ 5400 RPM, w/BB torque, 460 ft.lbs of torque @ 4500rpm. The weight savings will make your Stingray a better handling, better stopping car and you'll embarass most any BB Stingray whether from a 20mph roll, or from a dead stop start. GMPartsDepot.com has it listed for $4965.00 plus shipping. It will be tough to do a top notch rebuild on your BB for the same money.

http://www.gmpartsdepot.com/product1.aspx?SID=2&Product_ID=1223&Category_ID=2

Your local Chevy dealer may be willing to sell you the ZZ383 for the same or less money and there are other web sources too. HP ratings were obtained with a single plan GM aluminum intake P/N 12496822 ($304) and a 750CFM Denon carb with headers, which would add a few bucks to the equation. 92 octane pump gas and your good to go with a brand new motor and a GM warranty. Yes, you'll have to make a few suspension changes but no big deal. Your Stingray was meant to be a small block car and the 383 will make it an awesome car. Thinking objectively, I can't think of any reason to keep it a BB car. No axe to grind, just my opinion.

[Chuck S.]

Well, Hael, Werner...

I ain't got no axe to grind either!...Let me help these guys help you.

Here is the same engine nearly $200 cheeper at Scoggin-Dickey Chevrolet. Didn't know yer wife was to pre-disposed to changing all that stuff...I say, "Go fer it!!!" Kick butt...and if that ain't enough, spend some more! Drop in that ZZ502 and you won't have to change as much; it won't handle any worse than it does now. And, the ZZ502 is the "king of crate engines" (502hp, 567 ft-lb torque). Of course, it's nearly $3K more too, but think of all the money you'll save on mods.




Scoggin-Dickey ZZ383

[Scott Marzahl]

Heck, let's get more exotic than that....

I was thinking of a nice 427 small block build

[Scott Marzahl]

Oops, forgot to include the new Demon 6 pack

on top of that 427 small block, that would be a killer set up!

[Jeremy D.]

And if you got an extra 15 large floating around..

...Forget the ZZ383. Forget the ZZ502. Go for the ZZ572, 720 HP. version that is a VERY conservative rating.....put on classic BB valve covers, air cleaner, and such to make it look factory, and tell everyone you just have a 390 HP car. Then go out and shred accordingly!!

[Dick W.]

Re: And if you got an extra 15 large floating arou

All the horsepower will be nice, but remember that you still have 1964 technology for suspension, driveline, and last but not least, brakes. I think that anything more than a would be pointless with out suspension, driveline, and brake modifications. Have you ever seen the damage that a broken half shaft can do to the underbody of a Vette?

[Joe L.]

Re: And if you got an extra 15 large floating arou

Jeremy and Dick----

Yup. If you go with the ZZ572 you'll be shreding a lot more than tires. Most likely you'll be shattering half shafts, drive shafts, u-joints, spindles, spindle flanges, and differential internal components. You may even take out some transmission internal components since no Muncie, including an M-22, was ever designed to handle anywhere near the torque that the ZZ572 engine produces. So, if you want to use a ZZ572 RELIABLY, then you better be prepared to make a LOT more modifications to the car than the engine.

Like I've said before, there IS such a thing as too much power and torque in a Corvette (unless you're willing to make a LOT of other modifications to the car, including converting to a live rear axle).