1964 Matching Numbers Question

[Richard Abrahams]

Can anyone help me to find out about matching numbers. I bought a 1964 vette in March 2005, and dealer said it was matching numbers and showed me all the numbers that match and the Black Book. Now I am trying to sell it, and buyers are telling me that because the engine block number is a restamp that this means you can't call it matching numbers. The people who sold it to me say the number was restamped when the engine was rebuilt.
People have also told me that it's a particularly bad restamp (in other words very obvious that it was restamped).
I can understand how fraud might happen when it comes to a 1967 big block. I can see why someone would deliberately take a small engine car and put in a big block engine and falsely stamp it - you could make a load of money that way, provided it was a good stamp.
But why you would do that to a 1964 327/365hp I can't see - it's not worth enough money, and besides why would you do a bad restamp?
So I find the rebuilt engine story much more convincing, so it is original engine and is matching numbers. However, is there any way of proving it either way ?
Are there people around who I can ask for expert advice?
Richard
Darien, CT

[mike mccagh]

Re: 1964 Matching Numbers Question

take it to a NCRS regional or chapter meet and have it judged. good luck, mike

[Mike E.]

Re: 1964 Matching Numbers Question

Richard,
It sounds like you're trying to convince yourself by addressing us. Many, many Corvettes lost their original engine along the way and had any kind of small block, 283, 350, 307, or whatever one could find put into the car. Later on, someone had a problem with that motor (either mechanically or emotionally) and decided to put in a "correct" motor, because the magic words are "matching numbers." Those magic words raise the price on a car. I've seen many 62's that have incorrect copper/brass radiators in them with a Harrison aluminum tag on them, and now they are "matching numbers." Not at all correct, but with the "correct" numbers on them. That, and poorly restamped blocks are all about the same thing---how do I get more money for what I have?
It sounds to me like you took a hit from someone playing that game. You now have two options--try to find someone who hasn't been tuned into how the numbers should look and would buy into yours being "matching numbers", or take the hit on the dollar value of the car.
The only other option is that a prospective buyer is trying to get the price down by telling you something that isn't the case. Either way, your need is to do some research, look at some real cars, and evaluate the stamping on your pad. If you can't convince many people that it is the original (not just "numbers match") stamping on the block, convincing yourself of that has no value.
Good luck---and please know that we all pay tuition some way or another to learn---many of us have paid tuition in the form of not knowing what we were buying until after someone else, more experienced in the hobby and less crupulous,had already taken some of our tuition money, and we didn't even know we had signed up for the class.

[Jack W.]

Re: 1964 Matching Numbers Question

It is not at all inconceivable that a L76 (what you have) SB would be the subject of a re-stamp, not that I want to throw water on your hopes for a "legitimate" oem-type explanation for your situation. a good portion of a C2's resale value is affected by having an original engine - or not. Some would put that variable at 15 - 25%

There are some other things you can check, like the engine block cast date (I assume you have confirmed the block casting number is correct for your application), and other signs that the car was originally delivered as a 365 hp L76.

You can also post a pic of the engine pad itself, and let these experts tell you what they think - if it is "not a very good restamp" it should be easy to spot, or perhaps it looks ok after all, and some prospective buyer is trying to convince you to drop your price.

I am no judge or expert, but I am in Westport if you think I could help out.

[Richard Abrahams]

Re: 1964 Matching Numbers Question

Thanks Mike. I like your comment about "didn't know we had signed up for the class!" I'll go take a look at some other cars, but I'm pretty sure it's going to be a restamp. What I'm still not quite clear about is whether it is possible for the original engine to have a restamp, or is a restamp proof that it is not the original engine?
Richard

[Richard Abrahams]

Re: 1964 Matching Numbers Question

Thanks Jack,
I'm pretty confident the block casting number is correct. Not sure if I've found the cast date yet, I might go take a look for that.

[Eugene B.]

Re: 1964 Matching Numbers Question

Richard,
I'm sorry to hear that you are having this experience with your car and engine numbers.

If everything else on the car/engine checks out, perhaps the person that sold you the car was telling the truth. You say, they said: "the number was restamped when the engine was rebuilt."

Perhaps the engine block was decked when the engine was rebuilt and the block restamped to put the original number back. Kind of a long shot, but it's a possibility.

If you want to get closer to the heart of the situation, you'll probably have to consult an NCRS stamp pad expert.

Good luck,
Gene