Bird cage

[Ken Bushley]

Can anyone tell me what is involved in replacing the bird cage on my 75. Is it better to have someone do it for me?

[Tracy C.]

Re: Bird cage

Ken,

Replacing a complete birdcage on a 75 will cost more alone than you could ever recover if you hired this out. Removing every piece of fiberglass attached and reconstructing the car without assembly jigs would be an absolute nightmare to do on your own.

Either way, unless this car has some serious sentimental value, you're much better off looking for another project. If it's something you can't part with, just park it in the corner and look at it.

sorry,
tc

[steve wallach]

Re: Bird cage

Why do you think you need to replace the entire Bird Cage? You may be able to repair the problem areas? I can tell you, Tracy is right, replacing the Bird Cage is a SERIOUS commitment!

Cheers,

Steve

[Joe L.]

Re: Bird cage

Steve-----

Yes, complete "birdcage" replacement really amounts to "building a new car using some parts that came off the original car". The "birdcage" is the "essence" and "core" of the car (that's why the VIN plate has always been attached to it from 1963 through the present time). In my opinion, when a car requires complete birdcage replacement or, even, major repairs to the birdcage, it really becomes a "parts car". Whether it becomes a parts car to build its "successor" or whether it "disseminates" its parts as a donor so that other cars may live is the only question.

[Chuck R.]

Re: I feel your pain and don't want to be a downer

But.....I did the math on just the labor hours alone to peel the fiberglass away from the rotted cage on my 68 and the numbers were scary. I was looking at the fire wall back to and including the T-top center brace.

I picked up a clean Colorado donor body for two thirds my labor cost alone.

I agree that if you only have "spot" issues, then that would be a different ball game all together.

It's a can of worms that even the most skilled restorer's take on very causiously.

Hope you can find a solution that works for you,

Chuck

[Yves Thaens]

Re: I feel your pain and don't want to be a downer

Hi,

I'm sort of in the same situation. Some rusted through spots on the lower and upper corner of the windshield + the small piece inside the pillar (where nr 3 and 4 body mounts are) is rusted away (no rust on the siderails yet).

In the US one can probably easily get a replacement body, but in Europe this is much more difficult. Good rustfree cars are even more pricey. So i'm considering doing the same since I do have acces to a rustfree birdcage...But it just scares the hell out of me to be cutting up the fiberglass. The work is not the scary part.
The main problem to do is the rear clip. You need to completly take out the pillar post panel, which is bonded in between the rear quarter and the inner body part (don't know how that is called...)
I dissassembled the car that I've gotten the replacement birdcage from. Front and cowl went pretty good. The rear is a nightmare and probably you will end up with new rear quarter panels and pillar panels...I've build jigs myself to do the job, although I think rebuilding the body on a chassis and fitting, fitting,...will be just as good.
When I see the kind of rust and where it devellops, i think that eventually every shark will get this problem, sun belt state or not. So sooner or later we will all be talking about our birdcages and the rot on them. These cages were treated badly against rust and had no protection on the inside of the cage's parts. The smallest amount of moist will cause corrossion even when you don't see it at first glance. Broken up seams and bad quality sealing does the rest. Is there a place on earth where it never rains btw ?

Here is a website where you can get information : http://www.tropiczoneracing.com/Rebuild.htm

They got the cage out with only minimal/repairable damage to the body itself.

If you have the cage treated with zinc and then powdercoated, the inner parts of the birdcage while be protected with the way the zinc reacts/bonds to the metal, so probably it will protect the cage for 30 years or more...eventually it all depends on how much you love your car, how much work you want to do saving it and how long you want to keep the car. In the case of a birdcage transplant, by the time it is all done you probably will not ever want to sell the car...because you will never be able to buy one that is better (unless the project fails...)If your only option is to part out the car, why not part out the body first and see how it goes ?

I've got a question for the pro's myself : If you replace the rear quarters, do you also have to use fiberglass on top of the spliceline between the top panel and the rear quarter panel, or can you just bond it and finish it with bond ?

thanks

Yves

[Chuck R.]

Re: I feel your pain and don't want to be a downer

I think you would need to bond the panels back together, then glass the bonding strip area, and then finish it off with a quality body filler.

I'm not close to this learning curve portion of my project yet, but that's the way we used to do it in the shop years ago Yves.

Best of luck,

Chuck

[Yves Thaens]

Re: I feel your pain and don't want to be a downer

The factory never used any fiberglass on the splice line, so one would assume that bonding paste is strong enough ?

Thanks

yves

[Ken Bushley]

Bird cage

Well thanks for all the input that you guys have given me. The only real problem area is at the bottom of the hinge post pillars.U guess i'll have to check out the cost of just replacing those.

[Patrick H.]

Re: Bird cage

Ken,

Check into here:

http://www.cscreproductions.com/index2.htm

or with Caledonia Classics of Belding, MI. If those two firms don't make the parts you need, then they likely aren't in reproduction yet.

Patrick

[Bob U.]

Re: Bird cage

I did both from and rear pillar post replacements on 73 Roadster with parts from Caledonia. The new supports fit inside the old ones. Tack weld them on the frame and then pull body back off to final weld. Worked great, depending on all you replace, it may raise body about 3/8" further off frame.

[Patrick H.]

Re: Bird cage

Bob,

Do you mean that the body had sagged 3/8" and repairing these raised it back up?
I'm not sure why one would otherwise want the body intentionally raised.

Patrick

[Bob U.]

Re: Bird cage

Patrick:

I did not intentionally want to raise the body height, but after lifting it I found the sill rail was in really bad shape. The pillar inserts fit into the existing pillars and the replacement sill rail also fit inside the existing rail. If the existing sill rail was in good enough shape, then you could cut out part of it to permit just using the pillar inserts. The amount that the body was raised is the thickness of two layers of sheet metal the same gage as the original birdcage parts. While this approach will not pass judging as original, it provided a stong structure for a car I intend to use as a well restored driver.

Bob