1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Bob S.
    Very Frequent User
    • January 1, 2004
    • 135

    #1

    1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

    1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

    What's the maximum safe overbore for a 1966 327? Where does cylinder wall thickness / casting core shift become important? If I recall, wall thickness can be checked sonically??? Any suggestions where to find someone with this capability? Are any new technologies available for refurbishing cylinder walls other than simply boring larger?

    It has slightly less than 24,000 miles since a rebuild done for the owner prior to the individual I bought the car from. Documentation shows the block was bored .030" over and pistons, rings, bearings, oil pump, cam bearings, lifters, valves, guides, etc, etc were all replaced, but the cam was not replaced. I recall my previous owner related he had subsequent problems with several valve guides that he had taken care of. Obviously, I lament not studying the rebuild documentation more thoroughly before buying!

    After owning it for 2 years and only changing the oil twice (I've driven it just 2000 miles total), I finally got around to dropping the oil pan to fix a leaking rear main seal. That's when I made a very disappointing discovery: judging from what can be seen looking at the lower half of the rear main bearing, oil pump gears and cylinder walls, there's significant debris related damage.....felt with a fingernail. Two cam lobes out of maybe 7 or 8 that I
    can see are starting to show wear. Also noted is some crankshaft wear, again felt with a fingernail, on the land for the rear seal.

    Since the car is matching numbers (with a 1997 Top Flight award), I'm exploring the option of an immediate rebuild. (This will be my first time going beyond installing a cam in building an engine.....but I feel confident I can do much better than the last guys!)

    My goal is a rebuild that will last another 100,000+ miles if it's properly driven and maintained. I don't care about increased power, although I would like to do anything possible to enhance reliability / durabilty as long as it is internal and doesn't affect NCRS judging. I plan to focus on these areas:

    needs slightest possible overbore (i.e. new rings and pistons)
    new cam and lifters
    main / rod bearings
    valve guides / valves? (will inspect these carefully because previous owner related problems with some guides.)
    cam bearings?? (will inspect due to possible debris damage)

    Should I plan to replace the connecting rods and bolts? piston pins? Should I use hypereutectic pistons for more compatible expansion rate / more stable running clearances? What about the use of a deck plate during cylinder machinging? Is this a standard practice, or something not all machine shops do?

    Does anyone in North Carolina have first hand experience with an machine shop they can recommend who'd be sympathetic to a fanatic antique Corvette owner? My utmost priority is to complete a high quality rebuild while preserving the numbers matching engine. I plan to do most dissassembly / reassembly myself; relying on the shop primarily for machinging.

    After seeing horror stories of machine shops mistakenly removing stamp pad markings during block decking, I plan to insist on a written agreement placing a significant $$$ penalty in case of any screwups rendering the block unusable.

    Thanks in advance for any and all help / suggestions / comments!!

    Best Regards,
    Bob S.
  • William C.
    NCRS Past President
    • June 1, 1975
    • 6037

    #2
    Re: 1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

    Well, any good performance machine shop these days can check for wall thickness prior to boring an engine, but you did not mention any obvious damage to the existing walls, and the mileage accumulated would not create much wear, so until you get the engine apart, I wouldn'r get too excited. .040 pistons are commonly available, and generally a 327 can go to .o6o over and still function very well. If you put 100K on an .040 (assuming you HAVE to bore) you still have a shot left. At my age, I figure I'm on my last 100K of need with my current projects. I'll let Dick Whittington comment on NC engine shops, I'm sure he can recommend a couple of good options.
    Bill Clupper #618

    Comment

    • Bob S.
      Very Frequent User
      • January 1, 2004
      • 135

      #3
      Re: 1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

      Bill - From what little that's visible from below, there IS significant evidence of debris damage to the cylinder walls. I can see #'s 7 and 8 which are near TDC. There are numerous 'score marks' parallel to the bore C/L; running from the bottom of the bore and disappearing under the piston skirts. They appear deep enough to be felt with a fingernail, but I can't contort my hand enough to actually feel them. As you indicated, I'll know more after disassembly. After 24,000 miles since the last rebuild, the 'scoring' is MUCH more visible (and deeper) than the cross hatching.

      Thanks for the input! I'm relieved there's apparently more life left in this block.......Like you, I'm thinking that at my age and the rate I accumulate miles, one more rebuild should last 'til long after I'm "in the ground". Hahaha.

      Best Regards,
      Bob S.

      Comment

      • Louis Kolb

        #4
        Re: 1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

        Before going too far with your engine diagnosis, I would contact Dick Whittington or Jimmy Gregg. Dick is the NCRS Regional Representative and Jimmy is the NCRS Carolinas Chapter Chairman. Both can be contacted through their profiles on this board plus their contact numbers are in the front of the Restorer. Talk to the local experts first.

        Comment

        • Dick W.
          Former NCRS Director Region IV
          • July 1, 1985
          • 10485

          #5
          Re: 1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

          Bob, what part of NC??
          Dick Whittington

          Comment

          • Joe L.
            Beyond Control Poster
            • February 1, 1988
            • 42936

            #6
            Re: 1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

            Bob------

            A .040" overbore may still solve the bore problems. You need to get it apart to determine this. At a .040" overbore, I don't think that you need to be too concerned about sonic testing for cylinder wall thickness. Still, it would not be a bad idea to have it done. If you have to go .060" overbore, then you definitely need to have the bore walls sonic-checked.

            There is definitely a way to restore the block even if an overbore is ill-advised or not possible. That is to sleeve the cylinders with high quality sleeves (like Darton). This is a very practical, if expensive, solution. You can sleeve all 8 bores and get the engine back to standard bore. The sleeve material is much better than the native cast iron of the block so that's an added "bonus". The "sleeve-all-eight" solution is not practical for a "run-of-the-mill" engine since the cost is usually greater than the value of the block. However, for a Corvette "numbers matching" block, it's very practical.

            Your rods should be the later design 327 rods. If so, these are ok for continued use. They do need to be re-sized and it's a VERY good idea to replace the bolts at the same time. Use ARP Wave-Lok bolts. As good as these are, they are not too expensive. This is really a "no brainer". An alternative is to use a good aftermarket rod like Crower Sportsman. It would cost quite a bit more than rebuilt original rods, but would be bullet-proof in your application.

            I DEFINITELY recommend replacing the pistons with hypereutectic cast. In my opinion, this is the only way to go for any street application. Piston pins are included with new pistons, so that's an "automatic".

            Boring/honing with deck plate is not a standard machine shop operation. It's an EXTRA COST operation. ALWAYS opt for it.

            Cam and lifters-----reproduction of original; both 300 hp and L-79 are available

            Main/Rod bearings----Federal Mogul Premium Aluminum (AP)

            Valve guides------thick wall cast iron or bronze (only if required).

            Cam bearings---Durabond (only if required)
            In Appreciation of John Hinckley

            Comment

            • Bob S.
              Very Frequent User
              • January 1, 2004
              • 135

              #7
              Re: 1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

              Gents -
              As with the other times I've turned to this board for info, the response is truly phenominal!!! Many thanks.

              I'm located in Angier, NC (about 25 miles south of Raleigh).

              I'm attaching a macro photo I took of the scoring. It runs from the lower right to top left (parallel to the bore C/L. Note the connecting rod is visible to the right of the wall scoring.

              Best Regards,
              Bob S.




              Attached Files

              Comment

              • Dick W.
                Former NCRS Director Region IV
                • July 1, 1985
                • 10485

                #8
                Re: 1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

                Heinz Brothers in Statesville, NC does 1st class automotive machine work. They can do all that Joe recommended and more.
                Dick Whittington

                Comment

                • Bob S.
                  Very Frequent User
                  • January 1, 2004
                  • 135

                  #9
                  Re: 1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

                  Joe - What does "re-sizing" the rods mean? Does that refer to machining / or honing the small ends for correct press fit of the pins?

                  Thanks,
                  Bob

                  Comment

                  • Joe L.
                    Beyond Control Poster
                    • February 1, 1988
                    • 42936

                    #10
                    Re: 1966 327 Rebuild - I have many questions.

                    Bob------

                    Resizing refers to the BIG END of the rods. In this process, the big end of the rods is serviced to ensure that proper bearing "crush" is maintained.
                    In Appreciation of John Hinckley

                    Comment

                    Working...
                    Searching...Please wait.
                    An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because you have logged in since the previous page was loaded.

                    Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                    An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because the token has expired.

                    Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                    An internal error has occurred and the module cannot be displayed.
                    There are no results that meet this criteria.
                    Search Result for "|||"