C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

[Ed H.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Joe, was the 75B badged on any part of the lable or a stamping. I have yet to find any photos in the 90-91 Judging guide of stamping on the 75-525(L-98) or 75-695(LT5). I am looking for a photo of any 75B battery that could be used in the 92-93 Judging guide. I need photos of lables, date, and group codes, stamped or fixed into the surface of the battery. This project has turned out to be about only two items, battery and oil filter. Both items are in the wind, due to factory reconfiguration, discontinuance, or just plane gone forever. Shoulda, woulda, coulda. Take the deducts and keep on truckin.

[Ed H.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Lyndon, Thanks for the info, I will go on the net and see what they have. If it is not there I will call them after the 4th. Thank you again.

[Ed H.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Lyndon, I just checked the oil filter they (Paddock) have in stock. In the body of their advertisment they state "Not for ZR-Motors). Thanks anyway

[Joe L.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Ed------

I don't think that GM has any control over battery tooling anymore. Batteries were part of the business that was spun off to DELPHI about 10 years ago. Although suppliers to GM (like DELPHI became) often produce parts on GM-owned tooling, I think that batteries might be an exception. Batteries were always a more-or-less "generic" item. In fact, batteries were never available through the GM parts system----only through the Delco parts system. Still, it's possible, I suppose, that GM does retain some control over the tooling through their ownership of the Delco brand. If so, though, I would expect that the tooling would be made available through the GM Restoration Parts program if someone were so-inclined. After all, this battery configuration is obsolete and the tooling worthless outside of its value through the Restoration Parts Program.

If the tooling is controlled by DELPHI, that's another story entirely. DELPHI has no "restoration parts program" and I doubt that they have any interest, at all, in such a thing given their other problems. Worse yet, DELPHI is rapidly exiting the battery manufacturing business. Very little of what once was remains. My expectation would be that if the tooling is still in existence, it will be scrapped if it's not "rescued" soon.

[Joe L.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Ed-----

Yes, the battery was clearly identified as a 75B on the battery label. I took some pictures of the original 75B that I removed from my 1992 LT1 before I disposed of it. However, I don't know where they are now. It would require a lot of time to find them and I'm not prepared to invest that time at the present. I know that I still have them, though. By the way, I did not save the battery since my experience with long stored batteries is that they eventually begin to leak and create a serious saftey hazard in the garage. After all, what they leak is sulfuric acid.

[Joe L.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Ed------

I'm not so sure that the originals did not have the description "Duraguard" on them. The "Duraguard" designation was well-established by 1992. Although the original PRODUCTION, special, black painted PF-51 oil filter for my 1992 LT1 did not have the designation "Duraguard" on the label, these were a special filter and label for PRODUCTION-only.

I'm not sure that there was a difference in filters for PRODUCTION and SERVICE for the LT5 engine. The original SERVICE filters were black, unlike any other AC SERVICE filter of the period. I always thought that due to the very low manufacturing volume, the PRODUCTION and SERVICE filters were the same. However, I would not rule out that the PRODUCTION filters did have a different label. If so, just like the LT1 filters, the only way to obtain one of these labels would be from a filter off of an original engine.

The photos attached is an LT5 SERVICE PF-970C oil filter purchased in 1992.

[John D.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Ed, One of the members of our Pittsburgh Chapter has a June 94 low mileage ZR1 and it takes the PF970C filter. There are numerous versions of this filter but only one correct one for your car. The one that is currently available is a shorter blue one that has the incorrect decal. Until recently there was a black "tall" PF970C filter that had the correct configuration but wouldn't you know it had a black and white decal with a bar code. That won't fly for judging as it's a replacement. You would have to swap out the decal if they were available.
The 100% correct filter has the black and silver decal with no bar code.Thisdecal is quite similar to the PF25's of the same period but no cigar. Your decal should read AC Pf970C, then in small print 25014155. Next line is DURAGUARD, next line is Oil Filter. Nextthree lines say, Oil gasket, tighten 1-1/4 turn after gasket contat. Check for leaks. Then in small print Made IN U.S.A. By the way the kicker on finding the correct filter for any engine C4 is the following. On the bottom (which in your case is the top) there is a flat circle with a OD of about 1-1/4". On the replacment filters the circle is much smaller. The black paint is semi-gloss to gloss and the rim is painted also. A lot of the above info was supplied by Don Geary and me.

[Ed H.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Joe, in my first post on this subject I talked about my conversation with the owner of Restoration Battery Co. He talked about a bean counting group, I think he said the EMI group of GM or Delco. He said he had attempted to purchase the tooling die but was told no. He thinks who ever owns these dies is holding them for some unknown reason or they have been destroyed. As I said earlier, just take the deduct and go forward.

[Joe L.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Ed-----

EMI is the acronym for Equity Management Incorporated. They are the private, outside firm that administers GM's Restoration Parts Program. They arrange for the transfer of tooling and/or parts drawings to licensees and collect the licensing fees.

If the tooling for the batteries belongs to GM, then they should be able to arrange for the Restoration Parts Program license PROVIDING that GM is willing to license this part for reproduction. They have licensed earlier battery configurations that became obsolete. However, it may be that this battery is too recent of a design to license at this time. Also, as I speculated earlier, it may be that the tooling and/or manufacturing rights belong to DELPHI. EMI would have no licensing authority for DELPHI parts. Plus, I expect that the licensing arrangements for GM parts manufactured by DELPHI, and especially batteries, might be very complicated. So complicated that GM does not want to even get involved in it so they just say "no" to licensing requests.

I agree that with respect to batteries the best plan is just to use whatever current Delco battery will garner the most points and let it go at that. There are really not enough points involved to worry about. Certainly, there are not enough to justify pressing the issue of reproduction batteries for the application. Quite frankly, I don't consider it worth the price for reproduction batteries that ARE available for earlier model Corvettes.

[Ed H.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Amen Joe,
As an old military man I know what battles to fight and which one to draw back from. Maybe time will help. I will put my 40th ZR thru the system and let the chip fall (deducts) where they may. Thanks for all of your help. I was able to find an original oil filter thru John Degregory, I'm batting 500. I call this a good day. Lucky I still have the original tires and rims on this beauty. It came with the original build sheet and window sticker, sales documents, dealers brochure, salesman business card, a pen, flashlight, tire guage, and a note tablet in the owners packet, also, before I forget, the original video tape, instructing new owners of the amount of power in this beauty. The owner also has a chassis dyno sheet, laminated, which indicated a stock rear wheel HP of 354.55 at 5800 and a torque reading of 339.39 at 5100 RPM. Wow, what a car, what a country. Happy birthday America.

[Mike M.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

ed and joe:i have here in front of me the oil filters. Before i describe the 3 different filters , let me fill ya in on the history of the filters.i bought the 90, a late sept ZR1 when it was 4 mo old and had 1700 miles on it and i'm almost certain it had its original filter still in place when i bought the car. . the 95 crate engine in the willys has heads cast date in march of 93 so ed's comment that the last lt5's were mfg'd in 93 makes sense(i took a chainsaw to the wooden crate that the engine was housed in so i'm certain its the filter that was installed in stillwater, Ok). right after i bought the 90 Z in jan or feb of 1991, i ordered a case of filters from the local AC dealer.about five or ten years ago i bought a second case of oil filters for the LT5's. what i have here in front of me are THREE different configured BLACK LT5 oil filters. The one that Joe pictured in his post(lets call it the 2nd desing filter) is identical to the original filter on the 95 crate engine and also identical to the filters i got from AC Delco in the spring of 1991. The third design filter, that were bought 5 to 10 years ago, have five-colored labels(red, white, blue,yellow and black). the original 90 oil filter is bi-colored(black and silver) and lacks the Duraguard monicker that the 2nd and third desing filters do indeed have.the first design filter's label calls for PF-970. both the 2nd and 3rd desing filters call for PF970C. when one of my kids who are way more computor-literate than i comes home , i'll have them photograph the 3 different oil filters and will post them. may be a while for that to happen. let me know if i can answer additional questions. mike

[Mike M.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

i have the original battery out of my 90 ZR1 if its of any help. mike

[Clem Z.]

mike i bet you have a drawer labled

"string too short to save"

[Mike M.]

Re: mike i bet you have a drawer labled

i got many a 5 gal bucket full of used 10 to 20 penny nails. packrat r me. regards, mike

[Ed H.]

Re: C-4 Oil Filter & Battery re ZR-1

Mike, as you have noticed I am trying to document the original items mentioned. The photographs I come up with will be included in the upcoming 92-93 Judging Information Guide. If you could locate the date codes, any printing, or stampings on the top or sides of the battery, and send them to me (photos) I will include them in the number of photos I will be submitting for this document. I will be photo documenting the 92-93 ZR's. Let me know what you can do for this project. We are running out of time as the manual will have to go to print prior to the Jan 07 Regional in Florida. Any help would be greatly appreciated.