Undesireable 64?

[Gary D.]

Re: If I were restoring it

I have a 64 coupe very original but very tired. No one took care of theis car but they did not destroy it either. Unhit body and everything original. I am doing a frame off restoration myself and after I show it to see how well I did the 64 will become a new driver and I will enjoy it. My 71 conv I did the same and since 1992 I have enjoyed many shows and events with it and have not had to do any work to it.

[Charles K.]

Re: The person who told you this is an idiot....

The car is quite original and unmolested. The interior is 100% original and looks new. The drivetrain is all numbers matching. From the doors back the car is unmolested but the front has had a fender bonded in and the wheel wells may have had the lips reworked. The suspension is original, the car seems to drive pretty well, it tracks straight but just due to age should probably have the front end rebuilt.

[Louis Kolb]

Re: The person who told you this is an idiot....

The car can be origional only once but can be restored many times. If it's unmolested, try to keep it that way.

[Terry F.]

Re: The person who told you this is an idiot....

I would fix the front end damage back to original. I would replace front suspension components only as needed and be very concervative, give it a good 4 wheel alignment using original shims and stop at that. Nice original cars are hard to find and I love them! Terry

When it comes to ball joints, the lowers support all the weight and wear the most. I look at them closely. A-arm bushings are nice to replace also. Just find some originals or nice original looking replacements. To me the car is worth more original and functional.

Terry

[Joe C.]

Re: Undesireable 64?

Charles,

Assuming that all are red-on-black vinyl examples. Hypothetically, for any 300 horsepower, low optioned car, in very simple terms, most would agree that the most "desirable" MIDYEAR Corvettes are, in descending order:

1. 1963 coupe
2. 1967 convertible
3. 1967 coupe
4. 1965,66 convertible
5. 1965,66 coupe
6. 1963,64 convertible
7. 1964 coupe

You have a very nice car, with no probable historical value, so, restoration would not be a sacrelidge to historians. There are no "undesirable" midyear Corvettes. Join your local NCRS chapter, and enlist their help. You are about to embark on a very interesting and rewarding journey, into...........................The Corvette Zone.

[Tracy C.]

Re: Undesireable 64?

I wouldn't say "most would agree" to your ratings..

Assuming all are equally optioned and without A/C, I wouldn't have any coupe (except the 63) rated above any convertible. And I would also rate the 65/6 body style in last place due to the looks of the gill panels. For me disk brakes aren't that big of an improvement and I hate cleaning the brake dust off the wheels all the time.

To each their own when it come to preferences.

tc

[Kevin M.]

Re: Undesireable 64?

If you remove the body it will NEVER be the same.

Kevin

[Joe M.]

Re: Undesireable 64?

Most people consider any corvette undesirable. Room for only one passenger, prone to burst into flames in a rear end collision and cracks all over the body. However there is a subset of devotees and automotive afficinodos that really apppreciate a well presented vette.

A guy who once owned a 64 came up to me at a crusie night and asked if my coupe was a 63 or 64. He was aware of the 'split window', but knew that some early 64s were built with a split and they were really valuable. I never even corrected him. He just related some fond stories about his red/red ragtop and lamented ever selling it. 99.9% of anyone mildly interested in corvettes has no idea what constitutes a correct finish on a bumper bolt let alone the knowledge to tell a 64 from a 67 or even a 62.

If you are in the business of collecting and selling rare cars for a living perhaps the car could be deemed 'undesirable' given the initial investment. The only thing that matters is how you feel about the car.

The guy that called the 64 undesirable probaly told his buddies in high school he only went out with girls who were 10s.

As to rating midyears it is all in the eye of the beholder. Prices on 63 coupes are nothing to brag about and the talk of collectability doesn't seem to match the cash. 67s seem to bring the big bucks. To me a 66 is the best of that series but my heart belongs to the solid axles. A real clean midyear is a winner no matter the model year. Too bad about that back up light and hand brake on the 67s.

[Michael H.]

Re: Undesireable 64?

Joe,

You've made several interesting points, and I agree. There is no such thing as an "undesireable" 63-67 Corvette to people that understand and appreciate the cars. Some may be worth more than others, for one reason or another, but that has nothing to do with the car, just the hype about the car and the resale value at auction.

As far as the 64 model year is concerned, they may not be the most popular, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with these cars. Bob Zimmerman once said, and I agree, "of all the 63-67's, 64 is probably the most durable and dependable of all". No self destructing door trim, no leaky disc brakes, easy rear spindle service and a host of other items.

I like the side panel (louvers) on 65-66 best but that's just a personal opinion. I don't dislike the design of the 67 louvers but I never liked the idea that Chevrolet copied their main competitor, Ford, for the design. It was not a "Corvette first" design. Cobra had it at least a year before Corvette.

I've had more than my share of 67's over the years but it's the 63 and 66 that I wanted to have in the end. If I had a nice original 64, that would be a keeper too.

[Mike Iachelli]

Re: Undesireable 64?

My two cents:

First, maybe the person who said the 64 was not deserving of a frame off restoration was being honest that investing 40-60k in a 64, over the initial purchase price, is not a wise investment from a strictly monetary view. Total restorations of vanilla 64's (unless you are doing the majority of the work) is not a good way to increase your net worth.

That being said, if you like the car, spend the money and enjoy!

I am in the middle of doing a partial frame on restoration of a 64 Coupe. It has power nothing, manual brakes, hot as hell in the summer, spring, winter and fall without air conditiong and noisy...but the clock works!!.

Doing as much of the work myself as I am capable of. Having a blast! Loving the time spent taking away years of use, finding what others have done to the car in the past as layers of paint, carpet and trim come off. This is more fun than I can describe. In fact, calculated way past what it would have cost to buy a "perfect" car (no such thing for a 40 year old vehicle) but the fun factor and being able to show the pictures saying "I did this" is worth a lot more. It is great to be a member and watch this board, reading the hints and suggestions, discovering there are others out there that do this for the enjoyment of working on a beautiful car, not necessarily to build something that has the the highest return on investment.

If I can give any advise, do whatever you think is necessary for you to enjoy the car and do as much of it yourself as you can. It may sound strange but it is a kick to get down to the fiberglass and discover someone got lazy and cut corners during earlier restorations or repairs.

Discovered this car was restored in 1988. A pretty good job but it was funny to see that he matched the door to quarter panel lines with Bondo! Took a bit of work and a lot of trial and error to get the door gaps right but now it is correct. Paying someone else to do this would not have been as satisfying.

[Garry E.]

Re: Undesireable 64?

Charlie:

I was faced with a similar dilemma last year when I purchased a very pristine, low milage (54K), two-owner, '64 convertible with matching number 327/300hp Powerglide and un-hit body. What to do....? Full body-off restoration or restore as much as possible with the body in place. I chose the latter.... the body stays on, the paint gets freshened-up, the bumpers get re-chromed and the UPS guy becomes a daily visitor to my door, bringing packages from L.I. Corvette and Paragon.

This was the right choice for me since I intend to drive and enjoy this car. I didn't want to sink the additional $40-$60K into a body-off restoration, creating a $90-$100k car that I would be reluctant to drive. As it is, my goal is to create a car that can achieve a Top Flight at an NCRS Regional event - and that's it. No National event; no Duntov, etc. I want to be able to drive something that is "correct" as possible, but not "perfect".

It drives me crazy when I hear people comment about the "undesirable '64's". A guy in our local NCRS chapter was telling me about a conversation he had with Zora Duntov a number of years ago at a national NCRS gathering. Duntov told him that he was very proud of the '64 model for it represented more improvements than any of the other succeeding mid-year models.

Fix up that '64 and enjoy it.....!

Garry

[Tracy C.]

Zora was most proud to have won the battle with

Michell over the rear window. Zora hated that split as it was a huge design flaw from the driver's perspective.

Internal politics..it always was and always will be.

tc

[John G.]

Re: Undesireable 64?

I just recently went completely through, from front to rear, all 'wearable' parts on my '64. The intent was to do a frame on resto to R/R 40 year old parts. I tried to stay as original as possible with the replacement parts.

New DeWitt's resto radiator; new upper and lower front suspension bushings; new upper and lower ball joints; engine refresh; new LuK clutch; M-20 trans rebuild; driveshaft and halfshafts rebalanced; new trans slip yoke; wiper motor clean and re-lube; new rear cross member bushings; new rear axle spindles and bearings; new Spicer U-joints; new trailing arm bushings; master and wheel cylinder rebuild; new brake hoses; and few other parts like a new parking brake cable, windshield washer fluid container, new clutch rod components, etc. .. . The frame, engine bay and all suspension components were cleaned and repainted. Now that that mechanicals are finished the body and paint will get attention. Once that's complete I plan to drive the heck of my '64! ..

It took a fair amount of time to do all this work on my '64. The 'reward' comes after the fact. Everyting looks real nice now! The work was done 'in house' in my garage. With the cost of parts and some needed machine work I much enjoyed doing this work, myself. All told parts replacement, etc., came out to something over 3K - not too bad.

The sticking point and 'bad rap' that '64's get over having drum brakes continues to present day. Some things will never go away and for the '64's this will probably always hold true. Mine stops just FINE (metallic brake lilnings)! .. Also, the 64's having non-functional horizontal front fender 'slats', hood depressions, and perhaps several other items 'not to like' set this car apart from later model C2's.

[Jack U.]

Re: Undesireable 64?

Every book or magazine I've read indicate that all C2s are increasing in value unless they are totally undrivable or can not be repaired.