Understand from Quanta,etc. that frame part number stencil goes on drivers side. Does frame pull date go on drivers side also? Or does it go on passenger side? Thanks, John
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Re: 63 frame stencil
John, just found a picture on the 63/64 Restorer CD. It will not let me cut and paste the picture???? Anyway, both the stencil and the pull date are on the passenger side. They are both up-side-down. The pull date looks to be in white crayon. The stencil is on the rear portion and the pull date is just under the door.
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Re: 63 frame stencil
Harry, Thanks very much. You know must be the weather or old age 'cause whole life of looking at playing with '63's always see upside down numbers on pass. side of frame. Don't know where parts dealer got the idea numbers,etc. were on drivers side. Someone must have had frame upside down. embarassed. Thanks very much, JohnComment
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Re: 63 frame stencil
John
Some, perhaps many, original 63 frames have (had) the stencil on the left.
I am sure Michael will chime in.
Regards
GaryComment
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Re: 63 frame stencil
Gary, I just got some emails-one from Harry and others that some '63 frames had numbers on drivers side. So my criticism was invalid. Some say '63 frame numbers could be on either side. You have to be patient and not jump the gun. So many variations. Wonder what is most typical place for '63 frame numbers to be. Bet it's the passenger side and some on drivers side. Frames stacked outside St Louis plant, rusty ones brought in for new shiny paint jobs and probably some got painted on drivers side. After all what difference would it make. I can imagine the confusion on the line though when some workers looked at the one ink numbers to quickly see which side went up or down and found that BUBBA put numbers on wrong side. hee. Thanks, JohnComment
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Re: 63 frame stencil
John, Harry,
I've seen these frame part number stencils on the left side also. One such car was a black FI coupe in Lacon, IL many years ago. Car was Calif all it's former life and the frame and it's paint were excellent.
Not sure if there's a logical explanation other than it really didn't matter which side AO Smith put them on, although I would think there would have been some consistency.
There was also a writeup in an older Restorer about a 63 car in the 95xx range that Bill Sangrey owned?restored. It too had the part number stencil and date on the left side.
I've never seen one with the job number on the left side though. That wouldn't have happened. It was on the pass side for a specific reason.Comment
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Re: 63 frame stencil
I decided to look through all the articles from the restorer CD on frame stencil. There is a picture of a 63 frame with the stencil on the drivers side just behind the front left wheel. The owner who restored the frame said that was where the original was before he did the restoration.
HarryComment
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Re: 63 frame stencil
John,
When frames sat outside at St. Louis, or in transit from Smith, they did get filthy dirty, but there really wasn't any rust. They were shipped and stocked outside uncovered but the tar base coating that Smith was using was sufficient and very few small areas ever showed light rust.
The part number that Smith put on was also durable enough to make the journey and survive the temporary outside storage. However, even if it wasn't, it really didn't matter because it was of absolutely no importance to anyone at the Mill. Since there was only one frame for Corvette per year, only one part number would have been in the stacks, unlike a passenger car line.
The frames were shipped from Smith upside down and stayed that way during storage at the Mill. The stacks of upside down frames were moved into the building, half a stack at a time, and restacked at the beginning of the frame line. At that point, a worker added the job number to the PASSENGER side of the frame rail so the operator of the sling that picked up the frame and placed it in the conveyor could see it.Comment
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Re: 63 frame stencil
Harry,
Does the article give the aprox VIN of the car? I wonder if it's the same article I was refering too.Comment
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Re: 63 frame stencil
Michael, the number is 3490.Comment
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Re: 63 frame stencil
Michael, My '63 built March 4th. Need to put stencil on so rocker panel covers can go on. If it were your car I know you and Harry said put pull number on passenger side. Quanta kits say put frame number on drives side for '63. Some early known '63's have frame numbers on driver's side. Like your explanation of procedure used at St. Louis for frames. Noland has a lot of pics on frames as you know. I know you stay up late. Before night is over please give info on which side of frame best for frame number. Boston tea party around corner. I'll be up late tonight waiting for good answer. Silver springs not good answer. Like blue. Your friend, JohnComment
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I Hope All The Sissy Blue 63 FI....
...throttle return springs disolve away. You gunna have a vanity mirrir and tissue dispenser in your car too? (I just found a few more factory pic's of dk grey springs and one more early car with a silver spring)
Anyway, I guess you can take your pick on the Smith frame stencil number. There are documented originals numbers on either sides. Personally, I always like to go with the odd/unusual so the judges are scratching their heads. (gotta have proof with you though)
As far as early/late car, I don't think it's making any difference, so far. Harry just posted a left side stencil on the left side of 3490. There's one in the 8000 range and another around 16,000.Comment
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Re: I Hope All The Sissy Blue 63 FI....
Harry & Michael, Thanks for all the good info on 63 frame stencils. Appreciate help. Send cheep vanity mirrir (mirror) soon. Jorjorian likes blue springs he said. Said either color correct. When JD asked master judges at Auburn show which spring they liked on '63's. Black or blue. Answer was credit for either one. Silver nice looking spring also but not mentioned. Blue print for blue spring dated May 62 states on big note. "Painted blue for identification purposes." Like you and I discussed via email why it took so long for blue to make it on assembly line is a mystery to you. But no one including you my friend has been able so far to produce a print of a black spring or silver spring. Or should I say a part number as most of us don't have prints for every part. But what I really like about you is your method of thinking. You prefer parts that are not typical production and tend to use those to keep people guessing. On the other hand you mentioned that you do not get involved with the judging of cars or having a car judged. But your intensive research and ability to express yourself has been an asset to NCRS and it's members. Keep up the good work. It's intelligent people like you, Harry and others that make this fun. You can't beat education and that's what the DB is all about. I owe you one though for sissy blue. Later, JohnComment
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Re: I Hope All The Sissy Blue 63 FI....
John
Of all the things I've learned about Corvettes in the last 40+ years, I think one of the most important was the fact that we can't learn everything from books, GM files or even prints. What was supposed to happen, and what ACTUALLY did happened, is often two completely different things. I can give you a lot of good examples but I'm sure you, and everyone else, already knows of many of these "undocumented deviations" from the print, especially for the 63 run. Many have a good explanation but a lot if these things make no sense at all.
The original topic of this discussion is a good example. There's absolutely no explanation for why the stencil appears on different sides of the 63 frame as the months went by, but it's reality.
I've send you some good pic's of NOS and used correct 63 FI return springs, none of which are pastel blue. There are a number of great pictures of brand new 63 FI cars that show silver for early cars and the dk grey for later cars. I'm happy to hear that at least the JG accepts something other than blue. Hopefully, the early car silver will soon be accepted also. (check out page 135 in the Adams book. yes, it's a silver return spring)
I was the jerk that spent hours and hours (years, actually) documenting, recording and photographing everything I could on these 63-67 cars since the early 70's, when they were still close to the way they were when they left the plant. Amazing some of the things that weren't the way the engineering dept said they should be.
I'll try to have your vanity mirror in the mail tomorrow. It's the deluxe one with the light, for 63 FI cars only. Oh, and I think Jorjorian is pulling yer leg on the blue spring. He probably has a great big box full that he's trying to get rid of.Comment
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Vin 4000 and up PASS SIDE
Mike and John and everbody else all my years in the hobby all the cars Ive seen after 63 vin around 4000 the part number is on the pass side, have seen photos of early 63 cars from Carlos V from CA with it behind the left front tire in the wheel well area of the frame, cars vin I seem to remember around 1500 Phil 8063Comment
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