Judging policy when the manual is "wrong"

[John H.]

Re: AIM; shipping list of parts

Michael -

There's only one Miscellaneous Shipping List for the entire A.I.M. (in '67, it's in UPC 0, Sheet C1); in earlier A.I.M.'s it's in UPC 14. What are you expecting to find?

[John H.]

Re: Judging Manual vs AIM

Jerry -

The latest yellow-sheet updated 4th edition of the '67 JG has the battery cable part numbers corrected (I submitted it).

[Michael H.]

Re: AIM; shipping list of parts

John,

I incorrectly called it the "misc shipping list" and should have said it's the list of parts "installed same as", for the optional engine. In the 66 AIM, for the L36 engine, there's a list of components that are "installed same as" the L72 and I was hoping to find the belt number for the L79 in that section. Unfortunately, there's no list in the L79 section.

[Michael H.]

This Should Prove Once And For All......

...that the L79 350 HP cars were shipped WITH an idler belt. Pretty obvious in this pic. from the assy plant in 1966. Case closed as far as I'm concerned.

[Verne Frantz]

Yikes!!! Where did you get that Photo?!?!?!? *NM*

[Gary B.]

Photo from Noland Adam's book

Michael,

I know the photo. It's from Noland Adam's book. The photo was discussed last year and at that time someone actually claimed that the belt is on the wrong set of pulleys. Why they think they can detect that level of detail in a photo of so-so quality is beyond me, but this was not considered definitive proof to them. I disagree, but I'm not the person in charge of changing the JG.

Gary

[John H.]

Re: AIM; shipping list of parts

OK, that's the "Non-Illustrated Parts" sheet; there's one in the '67 A.I.M. in the L-79 section, and it shows unique-to-L79 parts that assemble the same as production for these two groups that would affect the captive belt issue:

UPC 6K1 Fan and Drive
UPC 6K2 Water Pump and Drive

The unique part numbers, of course, are only shown in the Engineering Parts List or Bill of Material, which we don't have.

[Michael H.]

Re: Yikes!!! Where did you get that Photo?!?!?!?

Verne,

This photo is all over the internet. Probably in Nolands Book also but I don't remember. Nice pic. If you blow up the original, you can pretty clearly see that the exhaust manifolds are coated orange also, but I don't want to start a whole new debate until the 810 belt discussion is over.

We can read all the books there are but seeing these things actually happen at the plant answers more questions that 1000 books ever could.

[John H.]

Re: Photo from Noland Adam's book

I have the original (3MB) ultra-hi-res digital image of that photo (taken from the original negative) provided to me by the GM Media Archives, and it shows clearly that that particular '66 L-79 has a 2-groove crank and water pump pulley, and has only one belt, running in the track closest to the engine. I'll see if I can cut out that part of the HUGE image and post it tonight.

[Tom R.]

JM as Gospel...that's the problem

I'm going back to some of the original questions and comments and realize the thread has evolved to particular C2 year and some belt stuff but in later years...like C3 new knowledge is revealed and there isn't enough ink to keep up with the changes. So some latitude is given to the owner (remember the "when in doubt...benefit goes to the owner").

How much originality has been destroyed due to the blind allegiance to the JM? If we want robots...we can ask GM for leftovers.

[Verne Frantz]

Re: Yikes!!! Where did you get that Photo?!?!?!?

Michael,
I agree 100%. The production line photos are worth more than the proverbial 1000 words.

(thank you for your help earlier today. I'll send you some pictures of the subject when the roll is done)

Verne......

[John H.]

Re: Photo from Noland Adam's book

OK, here's a cut from the full image that shows 2-groove pulleys and a single belt running in the #1 track.

[Michael H.]

Re: Photo from Noland Adam's book

Gary,

I agree with you 100%. I just enlarged the pic and it certainly looks correct to me. What groove do they want it on? If it were on the front groove, how would they install the rear belt? So, this isn't proof, but the fact that they can't find it in the AIM is proof??

There's no other belt, for any other option, that would have been pulled that tight before all of the other components were installed. (alt, PS pump, AC comp, AIR) This is indeed the mystery idler belt.

[Gary B.]

John; do you know which groove ...

the captive belt is seen on fully assembled cars? The one closet to the engine?

Gary

[Michael H.]

Re: Photo from Noland Adam's book

Thanks John. That sure shows the detail better than the pic I posted. Can even see the orange paint on the bypass hose. Now, is there anyone that still doubts the idler belt on a 350 HP? Dang, sure have to drag out a lotta stuff to prove a point sometimes.