70 Vert. Survivor ?

**Chuck S.** · August 25, 2006, 12:24 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

For original reference cars, see the Bowtie candidates displayed at regional meets and at national convention. Check cars against each other, and get a consensus. For base engine cars, you may have to fill in the blanks yourself if judges can't help.

Alarm harness routing: See AIM section UPC UA6 (in the options section at the back), pages A2, A3. If you have a specific question those drawings don't answer about the harness routing, ask and someone will help you.

Tailights were mounted just like the AIM shows with 1/4-20 nuts and flat washers (0.5" OD X 0.281" ID). These were cad (or silver zinc) plated.

Rear vent grilles are attached with flat head, cross recess, countersink screws, #8X1/2", black oxide finish.

**Dennis D.** · August 25, 2006, 05:02 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

Just got back from Carlisle. Closer to you than me. There was a 1970 Donnybrook green/ saddle deluxe interior, original paint! 43000 miles. Kind of partial to 1970. Car is really right. Selling cheap at 28000.00. (air/coupe base engine).

You can still get there

**Bill L.** · August 28, 2006, 12:29 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

Thank you for the responses. I could not make it up to Carlisle this year even though I am pretty close.

Mine is an L46 350/350 with P/W, P/B, TT, and 4 speed.

I talked with a couple people regarding the finish of the hardware including a judge. He seemed to think the hardware was a black phosphate finish on the tail lamp hardware. If it is the bright zinc that will sure make it easier to find.

Can you double check and let me know. When I took mine apart it only had nuts but they were black phosphated.

Also, do you know of anyone who specializes in hardware where I might find the hardware? I am having a very difficult time finding the #8 flat head screws for the rear deck vents.

Lastly, I think I have figured out the wire harness routing even though the AIM is not clear in and around the kick panel and brace areas. I was able to get the driver's side dash pad in unharmed. Now all I have to hope is that all the new bulbs I put in work when I test it before I start to button up the dash area.

As a side note I cannot wait for the JM to be released!

Bill

**Chuck S.** · August 28, 2006, 02:49 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

Hi Bill...What VIN is your car? It's possible there was a mid-year change, but as you said, zinc will be much easier to find at your local nut/bolt store than black phosphate. Mine were definitely zinc...that doesn't necessarily mean mine are original, or if original, that yours should necessarily be zinc if it's an early car.

I assume you did the reflected sunlight test to determine if they were black phosphate...black oxide will appear almost identical, particularly after nearly forty years. Of course, black oxide would not be as available as zinc either. My car WAS repainted once, but buying new hardware to replace the tail lights is not what I would expect on a commercial repaint.

Rear Vent Screws: Check Dr. Rebuild. My experience has been that the stuff Doc sells is correct, or he will tell you it's a functional replacement. See "F", right under the big red "68-79" in the heater box illustration.

http://www.docrebuild.com/dr-r-web/HEAT68-79.PDF

**Chuck S.** · August 28, 2006, 03:05 PM

UA6 Harness Routing

It appears to me the dash UA6 harness is routed with the instrument panel harness (in the same clips) behind the dash. When it gets to the driver side of the bird cage, it drops into the bird cage space behind the kick panel through the FRONT rectangular hole of the two there together at the top of that space. Inside this space, the dash harness connector makes up with the rear UA6 harness connector.

The rear harness then drops out of the bird cage at the bottom, passing out of the kick panel under the carpet, and is routed along a slight ledge (1/2" wide) inside the cabin at the door threshold. There should be two rubber/plastic covered clips along the door threshold...the rear UA6 harness is secured under these clips.

**Bill L.** · August 28, 2006, 03:39 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

Hi Chuck and thanks for the help on both counts. I am going to use what I have for now. I can change it if I need to later on regarding the tail lamp housings. I will do some more research and let you know what I find out.

I think I have the routing squared away.

I previously purchased the fasteners from the DOC. They are functional but no where near the originals. He also provided zinc nuts and washers for the tail lamp housings.

Bill

**Chuck S.** · August 28, 2006, 05:42 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

The Doc is selling incorrect parts??!! Say it ain't so!! You sure you didn't order the cowl grille set from Doc? Both sets would have eight black screws, but the cowl grille screw has a filister head. I checked Paragon for you, and their illustration looks like they are selling filister head screws for the rear vent grille...Paragon also usually has correct stuff.

Anyway, try these...they look a little longer than 1/2", but otherwise they appear correct. They say they are reproductions of the original, but it may take a close examination to know if it's the truth:

http://www.ecklers.com/product.asp?pf%5Fid=A5493&dept%5Fid=1502

**Chuck S.** · August 28, 2006, 05:46 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

Ah, shoot...that link doesn't work. Go to Eckler's site, and search for A5493.

**Harmon C.** · August 28, 2006, 06:15 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

Isn't a Survivor a car that has not been torn apart so you wouldn't need parts? This must be like numbers matching.
JMHO

Lyle

**Chuck S.** · August 28, 2006, 09:31 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

I agree. Survivor once meant something to the "Bloomington" judges...not sure if they still do that. Otherwise, its colloquial "Corvette Speak" like "matching numbers" IMO. I understood Bill to mean he wanted to SEE a known original car...the thing is, no one that has a car like that will let you remove parts to see what it looks like under the skin.

**Harmon C.** · August 29, 2006, 08:44 AM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

Chuck

If one is building a Corvette for Surviour judging or Bowtie this is not the place to ask how as lots of judges in both places will see the name of the poster and be looking real hard for tell tale signs if the car ever shows up.
I won't know by noon the name of the poster so I just look for stuff not done at the factory and after about ten frame offs it gets easy to tell the difference I need no extra information.

JMHO
Lyle

**Chuck S.** · August 29, 2006, 10:19 AM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

One of us is either misunderstanding, or maybe not comprehending. I don't think Bill is asking HOW TO BUILD A SURVIVOR (Do you have info I don't know?), or even that HE HAS ONE...He started out by asking where he could SEE ONE; and I told him where to see very original cars, including Bowties and Bowtie candidates.

His questions are not unusual...typical restoration questions. You either know what an original 70 Corvette looks like or you don't. I found my car to be very close to "original", and therefore offered Bill my opinion on what "original" looks like based on what I saw on mine. That doesn't mean that my car was 100% original, and I try to keep my mind open to learn new information if I have drawn wrong conclusions...This helps me bring my car closer to the goal of "original".

Unless I'm mistaken, the judging standards for Bowtie versus Flight judging are considerably different. My goal was always to make it look like it came off the line yesterday. As for making an old Corvette look like a "Survivor", I haven't got a clue; nor do I have ANY IDEA why anyone would want to manufacture one. (Oh, yeah, I guess I can think of one reason, $$$$$$). But, I would say "Relax", anybody asking what rear vent screws look like should hardly expect to fool NCRS Bowtie judges unless he's already 99% to Bowtie.

Anyway, I thought ethics precluded judges from using knowledge previously learned from outside sources; I thought judges were supposed to judge a car by simply looking at the car. Once a judge comes in possession of such knowledge, he has to be able to look past that "knowledge" to judge what he sees. If he finds he can't ignore previous knowledge, he should disqualify himself from judging the car...but that's just me.

**Harmon C.** · August 29, 2006, 01:31 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

The title of the subject says Survivor and I have no idea what he is doing or what he was trying to say. In my last line I said I will not know anything about this tommorrow so that takes care of your last paragraph. You gave him good information for flight judging and I told him what a Surviour is not end of story.
JMHO

Lyle

**Bill L.** · August 29, 2006, 04:01 PM

Re: 70 Vert. Survivor ?

Chuck is right. I simply wanted to crawl around and snap pictures of a survivor. Mine is numbers matching but clearly not a survivor. If I ever find a Daytona Yellow LT1 Vert Survivor, L46 4 speed w/AC Vert Survivor, or LS-5 Vert 4 spd w?AC survivor with deluxe interior I may have to spend my kids inheritance.:)

FYI-I ordered the vent screws from Paragon and they are labeled for the rear vents but are filister head with incorrect clips. I will be ordering the screws from Ecklers. Thanks Chuck!

I also just received a catalog from a company called AMK. They cross reference their fasteners to the GM pn in the AIM. However, their phosphate finish is not nearly dark enough when compared to the originals. Nice folks. Corvettes are not their specialty but they are considering getting in to corvettes.

They do have a few fasteners that are correct, but they will have to be cooked to a darker finish to be correct.

Bill

70 Vert. Survivor ?

70 Vert. Survivor ?

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