c3 restore show or go?

[Joe T.]

I have a 1969 coupe 390/427 that's mostly original. The only changes That I am awaare are a replacement short block (first owner), new cam and valve train (roller cam,lifters and roller rocker arms) and a new model of the windshield wiper actuator. I really would like to have this as a driver but I was wondering about its show and resale value to collectors. Its a big block air conditioned 4 speed coupe. Any opinions? Thanks and regards...joe

[Terry D.]

Enjoy it, drive it! *NM*

[Rich G.]

Re: c3 restore show or go?

This is my OPINION based upon only a short time (5 years) in the hobby. I have a 66 driver I thought I would like to upgrade and show, but in reality I have much more fun driving it and not fretting over the fact that the date is wrong on the alternator. I have a 68 big block 435 HP car with 34K original documented miles that sounds like your car, mostly original. I had it judged at a Chapter meet without doing anything to it, for example it had modern head lamps. It got a second flight. That was fine with me, but after that, I decided "been there, done that". I don't drive the 68 much at all. I love the fact that it's a "time capsule" but if I could only have one, it would be the 66 driver.

I have the utmost respect for those who restore their cars to exacting standards (because it's harder than it looks!) and who also work hard for NCRS at the meets. It's just not my cup of tea.

Rich

[Dale S.]

Re: c3 restore show or go?

Drive it, If you EVER get tired of that, then restore. D/

[Chuck S.]

Re: c3 restore show or go?

There are NO C3 big block Corvettes in near-original condition that are not valued significantly by collectors. I don't know what you paid for this car, but if you want "GO", I would buy a cheaper late-model Corvette or Camaro, and "git ohn wid' it". Full disclosure is that NCRS is a RESTORATION organization, so you'll get a biased opinion here. You'll proabably enhance the long term value of the car by restoration, but the irony is that good restoration is expensive.

If you have any documentation of the short block installation by the original owner, and it was installed by a Chevy dealer, and is stamped with GM information...do not be fooled, it's almost as good as having the original engine IMO. If you desire, the obvious external or internal performance mods to the engine can be reversed...in NCRS judging, it has to look and sound like a 427/390; otherwise, it's not a problem if you don't care.

As a collector car, the replacement short block has some detriment to value, but it's becoming less of a factor as these cars grow harder to find. Such a car, depending on condition, may do fine in NCRS judging...join up and bring it to your nearest chapter or regional meet.

[Bill E.]

Re: c3 restore show or go?

O.K. one more opinion. Show vs. Drive is really not a mutually exclusive decision. To restore to NCRS Standards vs. Drive may be but there are those who do both. As an alternative, a good clean Driver is right at home at local car and club shows and can be judged at a level consistent with the car's condition. Your NCRS connection and expertise on this Board can help you keep your car looking and handling close to "original" without taking it to Flight Judging standards.

My experience with a show car dates back to the late 70's and a 1951 Jaguar XK-120. After many months of work and $'s I was affraid to drive the car for fear of a paint chip. It was fun for awhile and I have some trophies and pictures but I really enjoy driving so I sold the car and bought a '74 XKE Driver. Yesterday my wife and I took our '74 Corvette out to see the Fall colors and hauled home some goodies from a country farm store. What a great afternoon.

Enjoy your Vette, it was made to drive. There is nothing sweeter than the sound and feel of a Corvette on a hilly twisty country road, even better than a Jag. Bill

[Chuck S.]

Brought It Back To You In Boxes!!!!...

I just read your profile...You are clearly a kind-hearted, good natured soul. If a friend told me he would restore my car, and then brought it back to me in boxes, I think I would have let him talk my agents...Smith & Wesson. Hopefully, he didn't also ebay some of the good stuff for you, and forgot to tell you.

It's bad enough for me that I'm the one that put my car in boxes, but to have someone else do it?

[Joe T.]

Re: Brought It Back To You In Boxes!!!!...

Thanks to all, Chuck your sentiments were mine and appreicated, but I am still working on that side of it. I think I have everything in addition to some parts that aren't even mine! I seem to have a small block fuel pump (slightly dented)from the same 68-72 timeframe that anyone can have it they need it or want it and what looks to be an AIR filter canister but my car didn't have the AIR stuff from the factory. More about that piece of gear later...Thanks again...Joe

PS: S&W entered my mind as well...

[Chuck S.]

Restore That Sucka...!!!

If the car is already in boxes, you're already one third of the way to your resto. My greatest concern for you is how he handled the fasteners; if he didn't identify and bag those properly, you're going to have a room size jigsaw puzzle, with ten thousand tiny pieces.

With desire and good mechanical skills, your Dad's help, and our help, you can do it. I will warn you, however...the disassembly process is where you learn the most, and you've been cheated out of the education. Hopefully, your "friend" didn't reduce the major components down to the nuts, bolts, and screws. If you run across a part you don't recognize, post a picture...some here could probably recognize the part by feeling it blindfolded.

[Joe T.]

Re: Restore That Sucka...!!!

thanks. I am going to need all the help I can get. My plan is to tackle one area at a time, the engine first, then the body/chassis, then the interior. My "buddy" just RIPPED the engine out and had it rebuilt by Pat Mucie then dumped it back in, not even on the mounts! I have some components like the AC comoressor and radiator/hoses etc in boxes along with the carb, exhaust manifolds and ignition system. Everyone's help and more importantly moral support is what will make this a labor of love. My fondest hope is to drive this to a near future show, not for judging or display, but for the sheer fun of it. I can't thank you guys enough already for getting me in the best frame of mind to do this the right way. Thanks Chuck and everyone and stand by for an avalanche of questions!

[tom444634]

Re: c3 restore show or go?

Joe,

I am wrestling with that decision myself. In October of 2005 I bought a very unmolested 71 LS5 4spd coupe. Most everything is original except the alternator. It has had one original color repaint in the early 80's and is now considered a 10 foot paint job. It has 120k miles and I have spent the last year rebuilding the front and rear suspension, the steering, the differential, the transmission and recently finished the engine. Through out all of the "mechanical" rebuild I have used stock parts because I know some time in the future I can see myself going "over the edge" for a full restoration. For now I am enjoying driving the car knowing that it is mechanically sound and looks good to boot. Next week I take it for new tires (the correct size, it currently has 60's on it) and then I'm done with everthing except the paint and once I get into that I'll need to make the "decision" of quality driver vs. show car.

I had a 71 SS 454 Chevelle that I did a total restoration on and was very successful whenever I showed it. But it was not fun to drive after the restoration because of my paranoia about getting it dirty and messing up the countless hours spent going over the smallest of details. Needless to say that car just sat covered up in the garage between shows since I did not enjoy driving it any longer. After having it for about 15 years I sold it and was actually happy to see it go.

When I bought this Corvette I told myself to take my time, enjoy the car as it is and drive it. I know myself too well and it won't be long before I go back over the edge, but until that happens I'm having a blast driving it. It's fun taking the kids around to their different events with it which is something I would never had done with the Chevelle!

Just my two cents........

[Chuck S.]

Re: Restore That Sucka...!!!

Uhmmmm...You want to drive it to a "near future show"?...Mmmmm, maybe you are looking at a targeted component resto/shine reassembly. Restorations take a long time if you're doing it yourself. A recent thread estimated about 2000 manhours...and that doesn't include the education time.

Anyway, here's your first tip: You may not do a body off resto...But, if a body off resto becomes your plan, be sure you do any body work BEFORE you pull the body. The body should be on the frame (with proper amount of shims at each location) to make any fiberglass repairs and to set your body gaps. You don't want to be doing body work on a restored chassis. You then have to decide if you want to paint the body on a dolly, or on the restored chassis. Painting on the restored chassis requires a lot of careful masking and preparation, and you may still miss something.

BTW, if your "friend" didn't pull the body, you're lucky...at least you won't have to figure out how many shims go where.

[Joe T.]

Re: Restore That Sucka...!!!

This is exactly the kind of info I need to keep me from getting into deep stinky. I guess I have to make the decision early on as to whether I do frame off or frame on? I would like to drive the car to keep my ambition up while I bring it along.. Let's see where my first adventures take me!...Thanks. Your interest and support is great

[Mark #28455]

Do whatever feels right to you

Your car is nearly original - don't let the lack of original block fool you, they're NOT that hard to come by! You can get a correct Impala block for about $1000 (you will only lose 70 points for the stamping) or an original 390 HP Corvette block for about $1500 to $2000 (and lose 35 points). You can easily still qualify for a top flight with either of these if you want to, and you can still drive it too! A 390 HP engine is a very reliable, easy to drive engine that still has as much or more pep to about 4000 RPM than a 435 HP engine.

A great driver, don't miss out on the fun.
Mark

[Chris H.]

Re: Restore That Sucka...!!!

I may be doing it differently than anyone else but I am restoring mine ('62) in parts and driving it inbetween.

I redid the interior to get it up to acceptable driving condition. New dash pad, carpet, armrests, repairs, paint; seats and door panels were nice but still need some work inside (need foam, window mechs fixed) but would do pretty good now for judging and driving. I drove it for 14 years this way. body was very acceptable but if you look close you see it needs some bodywork on the front and some crazing but everyone thinks it is in perfect condition (street folks).

Recently pulled the engine/trans and had them rebuilt. While out completely restored underhood area back as far as I could reach under the car. Restored, frame, front suspension, wheelhouses, all engine/trans components, dash components and now looks like new. Took about 6 months or so. Runs and drives a lot better now!

Late next summer, if the kids/wife let me, I will drop the rear axle and restore from the firewall all the way to the back.

Doing it in parts lets me get it done in chunks and allows me drive inbetween. Also keeps a lot of confusion out of all those parts laying around. I am in no hurry.

In the end I have gotten quite an education on this car. I may even take off the body someday to do a better job on the frame tops but then again I may try and "lift" the rear body up off the frame and "reach" the frame topside to clean up.

Chris