Judge my pad

[Tony 38901]

Looking for some honest opinions...Let me know what you think.

Thanks,
Tony

[William C.]

Re: Judge my pad

The CKY characters do not have the same spacing nor depth of impression as the first set of numbers/letter. It appears the letters were not set into a ganged holder. Can't really see any machining marks on the pad, photo's are tough to read.

[Tom H.]

Re: Judge my pad

Without examining it in person, I would think the stamp looks a bit suspect. Looks to be a 72 LT1 code.

[Chuck S.]

Re: Judge my pad

I agree with Bill; the CKY appears to have been stamped at a different time than the V0628 and the CKY characters are deeper. The Y is also clearly off the line and higher than the preceding two suffix characters.

Because I don't know if any Flint 72 LT1s were hand stamped, I wouldn't say it was a restamp. It would cause me some concern and I would be looking for other evidence of an upgrade. It would be interesting to know your car's build date...others may know if the car falls in the four months that C60 was available on LT1s.

Factory air could only be ordered on LT1s in 72, and then only for about four months...if the car also has C60, a price enhancing option, I would have even more concern.

[Tony 38901]

Re: Judge my pad

How were the characters in a gang stamp inserted? Were they slid into place from left to right, maybe something like this:
---------
V0628 CKY
---------

or was each character inserted vertically into the stamp, like this:

|V|0|6|2|8| | C|K|Y|

Does anybody have a picture of an actual gang stamper? Any pics of a late '72 LT-1 stamp pad so I could compare?

Thanks,
Tony

[Chuck S.]

Re: Judge my pad

Tony, Bill or someone that seen one will have to describe the stamp fixture.

If you're wondering if there could be horizontal separation in the characters, I would say not typically from the stamps I've seen. The separation between the characters is typically close and is only the margin on each stamp character.

That brings up another characteristic of your stamp that looks atypical...there is more separation between the V0628 and the first suffix character, C, and all the suffix characters are spaced wider than typical.

Do you own this car? Factory air 72 LT1s became a hot item back in the early nineties, and prices sky-rocketed. If you wanted to "upgrade restore" a small block 72, that would be the model to copy. I was looking for a 70-72 back in 1991, and came very close to laying out a bunch of bread on one...that is until it's, uh, pedigree came into question.

Sorry, I can't help with a photo of an LT1 stamp, but they look pretty much the same as a base engine stamp except for those last three little suffix characters.

[Chuck S.]

More

I should have re-emphasized that I am NOT saying that your pad stamp is a re-stamp. What I WOULD say is that the suffix characters for your stamp definitely APPEAR to have been hand stamped.

The font and spacing for the V0628 looks original to me. I'm also very skeptical that any existing suffix characters could have been removed without leaving some evidence of machining, grinding, or surface irregularity. Further, I'm doubtful that anyone could deck the pad and start over with a new machine stamp and make the V0628 look that original.

A Flint machine stamp, with the suffix characters hand stamped later, with no evidence of any grind out is a mystery I can't decipher. People smarter than me may have the answer.

[Tony 38901]

Re: Judge my pad

Yes, this is my car. It is also an air car, which I've owned for the past four years. All the experts who viewed the car in person have suggested that the stamping is unusual, but that the broach marks look good. They never commented on whether or not the AC was "suspect".
I managed to find a good thread on gang-stamps along with a pic:

http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=23029

[John Daly]

Re: Judge my pad

tony,
This will give you an idea of the gang holder. This company is/was a supplier of the stamps and holders.
john

http://www.gtschmidt.com/typeholders/index.html

[Terry M.]

pic by John Z *NM*

[Chuck S.]

Re: Judge my pad

Good find on the Camaro stamp thread...that guy JohnZ sounds vaguely familiar.

The AC is not likely to be suspect...If counterfeiting a C60 LT1, it would make sense to start with a small block air car.

[Dick W.]

Re: Judge my pad

I know of at least one 1972 LT-1 that had the air added. They bought a donor car, just swapped every thing concerned, then sold the donor. They ran me crazy (yes Chuck, I know it was a short trip ) asking questions. Best I remember it looked pretty darned good.

[Chuck S.]

Re: Judge my pad

OK, if you already HAD a genuine LT1, then adding the AC could be a temptation. That assumes your conscience would allow you to alter a perfectly original car to add a value enhancing option...I'm sure some would have no problem with that.

But, as Yves Thaen pointed out in the earlier thread about modifying the heater fire-wall cut-out, there are some basic differences between the AC and non-AC bodies that are not easily changed...it's not merely a cosmetic change-out. I didn't pipe up in that thread because I hadn't studied the AIM to confirm the details, but to ADD C60, the body side plenums would probably have to be modified and the RH fresh air valve added.

[Dick W.]

Re: Judge my pad

Trust me, the dealer that added the A/C had no conscience, or at least did not have one until Uncle IRS paid him a visit a few years back. He did the car and sold it to a "pilgrim" for big bucks. At least the car is still in a private collection.

[Chris Patrick]

Re: Judge my pad

"OK, if you already HAD a genuine LT1, then adding the AC could be a temptation. That assumes your conscience would allow you to alter a perfectly original car to add a value enhancing option...I'm sure some would have no problem with that."

That could be true on a car done today in in the last dozen years or so, but once upon a time, people did this to make the car they wanted. I remember a guy with a '63 coupe that was fuel injected and had AC. I don't think the original car started with either, but that is what he wanted.

Most people pulled AC off a car to enhance performance, but some actually added to cars that either they had or couldn't get AC on. I ran into a guy around St. Louis with a gray '67 convertible that had an L88 and AC. Don't know if either were original, but he had what he wanted.