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Hello all. Does anyone out there have an original key envelope for '69 and up (with square key)? I just received a reproduction key envelope from a very well known and respected vendor and have 2 questions for anyone who has an original. 1. Is the printing crisp and clear including the writing and outlines of the key or are they blurred and hard to read? 2. Does the "flap" have adhesive on it like a modern coin envelope? Thanks as always for your help.
Jeff
Jeff, Where did you order the reproduction key envelope? I tried to order one from MF Dobbins website which seems to be dead when you try to submit a order. I sent an email with no response back. They had a ad in the latest NCRS Driveline for $5 for the reproduction key envelope. DD
Yes, the link from Yankee Lady to MF Dobbins is essentially defunct and it 'appears' that he's out of business. But, he's still alive/well and doing business, I talked to him and ordered some items just last month.
He's not really 'big' on computers/internet and since the lion's share of his business goes to market via stocking distributors, he simply doesn't see the 'need' to re-establish a direct market link for qty one purchasers.
But, you can easily contact him directly:
(215) 657-8571
CDOB129720@aol.com
One thing we DID yak about was his new product (Shark key envelope) which IS the topic of this thread. He was interested in hearing about how the product was being accepted because he was concerned some would think it was 'shoddy' due to the blurred printing...
He said he'd made the repro from a small sample of originals he'd been able to gather over the years and ALL of them had 'fuzzy' print quality. Soooo, he duplicated that fuzziness EXACTLY as he'd observed on the originals!
He knows he has NOT seen a large sample of originals (guess why...most owners threw them away) and didn't know if the few he had were simply poor quality factory originals or had been blurred due to time/handling. BUT, he concluded that if the blurry print was the result of time/handling, it'd be atypical for ALL of the originals he had to be 'defective' in exactly the same manner.
So, he intentionally copied the 'defects' he observed in his reproduction. Anyone with known original key envelopes from the era are welcome to call/chat as he's hungry for feedback and more information on this subject! Who knows, perhaps there were multiple printing runs over time and all of his samples came from the same run...
John, You and Peter Lindahl are 100% correct. Sorry. I was thinking of another bag that is typically missing on the midyears. The license plate hardware bag.
Look in the 63 Aims Sect 14 Sheet A.8.00 Page 234 or pg 212, Miscellaneous Shipping List. (I have an old Drafting Graphics book-234. Mid Amer 212.
7th item down. 3690446 Bag. Note 6. Bag used for license plate attaching parts container.
This should be in the glove box. Includers the pan head screws for the license plates and the plastic nuts. Have you ever seen one of these bags? Didn't want to talk about this now but since I screwed up I had to just to keep the key guy happy.
Thanks for correcting my senior moment.
By the way-this bag should be in all 63's and later midyears. Your thoughts please?
Sorry Lindahl. Thanks for the nice email though. Glad to hear that you and CC are agreeing on the orange plug. Even though it's a jerk fitting.Oops. Typo.
Thanks, John D.
I hope I did not add to the sample of blurred key envelopes but I bought a copy in about 1995 that was blurred and made a few copies for my own use and gave a few away at NCRS meets. Just like a chain letter who knows how many times it may have been copied since 95. It may be easier now to find a copy than an original. If the judging manual said we needed something some of us just made it happen if we could find a sample.
Lyle
Yup, in '63 the parts were released separately (3794162 screws, 3783004 nuts, and 3690046 bag). In early '64, they were consolidated (screws, nuts, and bag) as P/N 3858189 License Plate Attaching Unit, which carried through '65. In '66 the Unit became P/N 3875313, which carried through 1967; the part number changed because only the screws were in the bag - the plastic nuts were changed from 3783004 to 3869819, and were installed in the brackets at the plant. The plastic nuts were changed again in 1967 from 3869819 to 3907444, also installed in the brackets at the plant.
I can't remember if the printing is clear on my 1970 -- I think it is, but I know it has the gumming on it. This is one of the features savvy judges look for. Copy machines can easily reproduce a fair facsimile of the bag, but so far the gumming has escaped the reproduction.
I have judged some that were nice and clear. In fact, last year at San Antonio, we showed one owner his repro beside an original. The repro had fuzzy print; the original didn't.
I have also seen a difference in the width of the border around GM in the corner. However, we do need a larger sampling to determine. I judged one at Marlborough this week that had a 1968-style key drawing, no glue, and the wrong shape to the flap.
Thank you all for responding to my questions. This all began when I followed an Ebay sale of 2 keys and envelope some weeksd ago. I had downoaded the picture from the Ebay sight and had started working on a reproduction for myself and perhaps get licensed to sell to others. Then I saw the ad in the Driveline and decided that if someone already is doing it I may as well buy from him and drop the idea. When I received them (some for friends)I wanted to check with you all concerning the questions I had. The downloaded copy, while very blurry and out of proportion, shows that the lettering and numbering is readable and probably sharp. Even blurred I could read every letter and number whereas on the reproduction I couldn't. If the originals were printed like that from GM then I completely understand the sellers option to design in the flaws. I just find it hard to believe that GM would release a part intended to be read with such flaws. Anyway I maght have access to an original from a very low mileage, original owner '72 who says he has everything that came with the car when he bought it new. If I get to see it I will report to you all here. Thanks again for your help.
Jeff
"I just find it hard to believe that GM would release a part intended to be read with such flaws."
So, if you were the Corvette Plant Manager and a run of envelopes that you'd paid for came in being blurry and you knew the envelopes were intended simply to get the keys from the plant to the delivering dealer, you're saying you'd have rejected/scrapped them and shut down production until a 'proper quality' envelope was received and put in stock, eh? Methinks you wouldn't have kept your job position with GM for very long!
Jack:
Even in times when quality control was not the beat, company image in print was important. Maybe this is a very naive view but I do believe that if a run of these came in so poorly as to reflect badly on the company, someone would make the decision to scrap them and get a fresh batch since we all know that the vendor who produced them was going to pay not GM. Maybe I need to get a dose of "reality serum".
Jeff
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