C3 front suspension

[Jordan S.]

I would like opinions regarding a front suspension rebuild. My 70 LS-5 is mostly original including ball joints still riveted in, rotors riveted to hubs, original shocks and springs with remnant of original HU stickers in place. Unfortunaltely, rusty and tired.

Is it worth investing in "reproduction" ball joints or are "replacements" acceptable? Does anyone know of a shop in the North East/ NY area that does Ball Joint Riveting?

The car is sitting low in front but the original shocks were stiff/worn out. I have read on other threads that re-using original springs with new bushings/ shocks restored ride height. Is this possible? How can I check the original springs to see if they're still usable? Suggestions on shocks? I plan on driving the car but eventually will have it NCRS judged.

Thanks for your advice.

Jordan

[Michael W.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Aside from saying that it's rusty and sitting low in front, what's actually wrong with it? Changing parts just for fun gets very expensive and makes it that much harder to 'stay original' for Flight Judging purposes.

BTW- shocks new/old/worn have nothing to do with ride height, nor do the front bushings or ball joints.

[Michael W.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Aside from saying that it's rusty and sitting low in front, what's actually wrong with it? Changing parts just for fun gets very expensive and makes it that much harder to 'stay original' for Flight Judging purposes.

BTW- shocks new/old/worn have nothing to do with ride height, nor do the front bushings or ball joints.

[Joe L.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Jordan-----

Usually, the upper ball joints will be ok. They are very long-lived under most conditions.

FUNCTIONALLY, high quality replacement ball joints are fine. There will be a slight point deduction for judging purposes, though. The reproduction joints have an external configuration very similar to original joints. They may suffer no judging penalty. However, I worry about the functionality of these joints with respect to durability, performance, etc. The effort that's gone into making them appear like the originals does not necessarily extend to functionality like the originals. If they are manufactured by a firm that has experience in manufacturing ball joints, they're probably fine. If they are manufactured by a firm that concentrates on making something look like something else, that's another story. I believe these are made in the "far east" and there are both kinds of companies there. Hopefully, though, the product liability insurance of the manufacturer or US distributor helps to ensure that, at least from a safety perspective, these are ok.

For a ball joint riveting source in the northeast, Bair's in Linesville, PA is going to be an excellent provider in all respects.

Re-using original springs with new bushings, cushions, liners, etc. and restoring original ride height usually applies to the REAR spring. However, to a lesser degree it it also applies to the front. You can measure the various chassis specifications contained in your AIM or Chevrolet Service Manual and see how yours compare to original specs. If they're within specs, you're ok. If not, you'll need to rebuild the suspension. After the front springs are out, you can inspect them for serious corrosion (almost always "terminal" for a coil spring) and check them for free height. That will provide an indication of their serviceability. I don't know of any way to "rebuild" a coil spring.

For shocks, the current Delco offerings are about the best you can do. They are not configured exactly like originals, are not STAMPED Delco, and are manufactured by an outside supplier (like most current GM parts). However, they are modestly priced, will perform well, and are as close to original configuration as any shock you're going to find in current production.

[Joe L.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Jordan-----

Usually, the upper ball joints will be ok. They are very long-lived under most conditions.

FUNCTIONALLY, high quality replacement ball joints are fine. There will be a slight point deduction for judging purposes, though. The reproduction joints have an external configuration very similar to original joints. They may suffer no judging penalty. However, I worry about the functionality of these joints with respect to durability, performance, etc. The effort that's gone into making them appear like the originals does not necessarily extend to functionality like the originals. If they are manufactured by a firm that has experience in manufacturing ball joints, they're probably fine. If they are manufactured by a firm that concentrates on making something look like something else, that's another story. I believe these are made in the "far east" and there are both kinds of companies there. Hopefully, though, the product liability insurance of the manufacturer or US distributor helps to ensure that, at least from a safety perspective, these are ok.

For a ball joint riveting source in the northeast, Bair's in Linesville, PA is going to be an excellent provider in all respects.

Re-using original springs with new bushings, cushions, liners, etc. and restoring original ride height usually applies to the REAR spring. However, to a lesser degree it it also applies to the front. You can measure the various chassis specifications contained in your AIM or Chevrolet Service Manual and see how yours compare to original specs. If they're within specs, you're ok. If not, you'll need to rebuild the suspension. After the front springs are out, you can inspect them for serious corrosion (almost always "terminal" for a coil spring) and check them for free height. That will provide an indication of their serviceability. I don't know of any way to "rebuild" a coil spring.

For shocks, the current Delco offerings are about the best you can do. They are not configured exactly like originals, are not STAMPED Delco, and are manufactured by an outside supplier (like most current GM parts). However, they are modestly priced, will perform well, and are as close to original configuration as any shock you're going to find in current production.

[Ken B.]

Re: C3 front suspension

jordan...where in new york are you.I am in West seneca(near Buffalo) there are a couple places that may be able to do that..

[Ken B.]

Re: C3 front suspension

jordan...where in new york are you.I am in West seneca(near Buffalo) there are a couple places that may be able to do that..

[Jordan S.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Ken,

I'm in Rockland County about 30 min north of manhattan. A bit far from Buffalo. If you have a reputable place that does the rivets, I have no problem using UPS.

Thanks for the input.

[Jordan S.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Ken,

I'm in Rockland County about 30 min north of manhattan. A bit far from Buffalo. If you have a reputable place that does the rivets, I have no problem using UPS.

Thanks for the input.

[Jordan S.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Joe,

Thanks for the Info. I looked in my assembly manual but can't find reference to Free Height of springs. They appear structurally sound. DO you know any references for this info?

Thanks again.

Jordan

[Jordan S.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Joe,

Thanks for the Info. I looked in my assembly manual but can't find reference to Free Height of springs. They appear structurally sound. DO you know any references for this info?

Thanks again.

Jordan

[Joe L.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Jordan------

You won't find spring free-height information in either the assembly manual or the Chevrolet Service Manual and I didn't mean to imply that you could. What you can find in those references is information regarding various chassis dimensions and interrelationships between suspension components, as designed. If those are found to be ok, you can assume that the springs are within spec. This is a lot easier than removing the springs from the car just to see if they are in-spec.

The free height for your springs if the car also has C-60 should be about 15-3/4" in new condition. I can't find the spec for the non-C-60 68-71 big block springs right now.

[Joe L.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Jordan------

You won't find spring free-height information in either the assembly manual or the Chevrolet Service Manual and I didn't mean to imply that you could. What you can find in those references is information regarding various chassis dimensions and interrelationships between suspension components, as designed. If those are found to be ok, you can assume that the springs are within spec. This is a lot easier than removing the springs from the car just to see if they are in-spec.

The free height for your springs if the car also has C-60 should be about 15-3/4" in new condition. I can't find the spec for the non-C-60 68-71 big block springs right now.

[John H.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Free height of a spring (out of the car) is pretty meaningless; Engineering rated and specified spring height at their design load, to produce a given design ride height. The measurements to check whether the springs are within the design tolerance for ride height are shown in the assembly manual; it's "Z" Height for the front, in UPC 3 of the assembly manual, and "D" Height for the rear, in UPC 4; both measurements are independent of tire size. Both illustrations show the quick and simple measurements to ground to derive the numbers.

[John H.]

Re: C3 front suspension

Free height of a spring (out of the car) is pretty meaningless; Engineering rated and specified spring height at their design load, to produce a given design ride height. The measurements to check whether the springs are within the design tolerance for ride height are shown in the assembly manual; it's "Z" Height for the front, in UPC 3 of the assembly manual, and "D" Height for the rear, in UPC 4; both measurements are independent of tire size. Both illustrations show the quick and simple measurements to ground to derive the numbers.