70 Exhaust System Replacement - NCRS Discussion Boards

70 Exhaust System Replacement

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  • Bill L.
    Expired
    • February 1, 2004
    • 1403

    70 Exhaust System Replacement

    I am in the process of replacing the complete exhaust system on a SB 350/350 4 speed. The car has headers and there is nothing correct regarding the exhaust system except the tips.

    Whose exhaust sytem is the most correct and properly fitting? I will take the hit for aluminized. Does anyone make the correct muffler hangers, clamps, and mounting hardware? I reviewed the archives but I suspect the info may be dated. Volunteer Corvette and Corvette Central were mentioned.

    The tips are original but have been welded to the exisitng mufflers. How difficult and are there any tricks to grinding off the weld and pipe to get back to the original metal of the tips? The tips with no seam are almost impossible to find so I am hoping I can save them.

    Since I am doing this I am going to install all the shielding too. Are any of the repros correct including heat shields? Does anyone have good pictures of the shielding installation? The AIM shows it but it is not real clear.

    Thank for any help!

    Bill
  • Kent K.
    Extremely Frequent Poster
    • December 1, 1982
    • 1139

    #2
    Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

    Bill,
    Suggest Allens for the exhaust pipes & mufflers. Don't think they have hangers. Try Doc Rebuild, Corvette Central or Paragon for them & ingition shielding. They should also have the heat shields. Doc Rebuild has the best on-line catalog with diagrams, pictures, etc.
    Happy New Year, Kent
    Kent
    1967 327/300 Convert. w/ Air - Duntoved in 1994
    1969 427/435 Coupe - 1 previous owner
    2006 Coupe - Driver & Fun Car !!!
    NCM Founder - Member #718

    Comment

    • Peter B.
      Expired
      • July 31, 2000
      • 155

      #3
      Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

      Bill

      I did not have headers, I had the standard exhaust manifolds. I bought the Corvette central package. I bought the 2.5inch (if I remember correctly). I do remember it was larger in diameter than the one I had there originally. I also selected the package that had the Magnaflows. Great flow through exhaust and great sound and has stainless packing. The Flowmasters I had heard that resonate and are anoying at idle since they are hollow inside.

      Overall, the kit was 100% perfect in every way. All the parts fit in perfectly.

      Funny story - I had to finish it once I started the project and finished at 4am. Well, you guessed it. I turned on the car and let-r-rip at 4am. Sounded sweet then and sweet now.

      Good Luck.

      Comment

      • Warren F.
        Expired
        • December 1, 1987
        • 1516

        #4
        Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

        Bill,

        I have two 1971 coupes. One car had an aluminized exhaust system on it, when purchased, so I had no idea who manufactured it. I too did not know who carried the most accurate reproduction system, so I took a gamble and ordered an exhaust system for the other car, which had aftermarket side exhaust on it. I chose Corvette Centrals system, when it arrived I compared the two systems, as the one on the white car is extremely close to factory appearance as far as flattened spots, bends etc. I can tell you that the CC system is not as close to factory specs as I had hoped, there are very easily discernable differences in the piping, although the mufflers look to be exactly the same between the two. I am actually looking forward to putting on the CC system as the piping is not as squished as the other cars and I hope it will actually make more power. One car has F41 suspension so I believe there will be less suspension travel and therefore the less flattened piping will have sufficient clearance. The other car with std suspension has the more correct flattened piping and I believe the suspension componentry does travel more with the softer suspension pieces.

        Comment

        • Joe L.
          Beyond Control Poster
          • February 1, 1988
          • 43193

          #5
          Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

          Bill and Warren------

          There is NO exhaust system on the market today that is an exact reproduction of the originals. I believe that the original rear pipes were die-formed pieces and there is no way that one can achieve the configuration of the rear pipes, both 2" and 2-1/2" versions, without die-formed reproductions. The cost of that tooling would be so great that I can't imagine anyone doing it. There may have been some original pieces or SERVICE pieces that were not die-formed but I believe the vast majority of the originals were die-formed.

          There are many mufflers on the market today that are very close to the EXTERNAL configuration of the original mufflers. However, there are NONE that I know of that are of similar INTERNAL configuration which affects the exhaust "tone".

          I really think that the Allen's or Corvette Central exhaust systems are about as close to the originals as you are going to find on the market today.

          I understand that Gardner Exhaust is coming out with a closer-to-original reproduction of the Corvette exhaust systems. I'll be able to evaluate them when they are available. I just don't see how they are going to replicate the configuration of the rear exhaust pipes without going to a die-formed piece and I can't imagine that they are going to go to that much expense.
          In Appreciation of John Hinckley

          Comment

          • Warren F.
            Expired
            • December 1, 1987
            • 1516

            #6
            Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

            Joe,

            Your certainly right, but wherever the pipes came from on my white car are sure close. Just wish I knew who supplied them.

            I am anxious to see Gardners version as well. They were soliciting for original pipes on the CF board, apparently looking for some to make patterns off of.

            Comment

            • Lyndon S.
              Expired
              • April 30, 1988
              • 1027

              #7

              Comment

              • Joe L.
                Beyond Control Poster
                • February 1, 1988
                • 43193

                #8
                Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

                Warren------

                Several possibilities. They could be GM SERVICE pipes. They could also be replacement pipes available from Walker or Arvin in days-of-old. Another possibility is pipes from a chain like Midas that, in days-of-old, obtained their pipes from Walker or Arvin, but Midas-branded.

                In days-of-old when the pipes were being manufactured for GM PRODUCTION and SERVICE, replacement pipes and mufflers obtained from Walker, Arvin and others (who got their pipes from Walker or Arvin) were often the same as GM pipes and mufflers. However, after manufacture of the pipes and mufflers ceased for GM, I think that the manufacture of Walker and Arvin pipes and mufflers was transferred to their aftermarket parts operations and were manufactured using different tooling and manufacturing technologies. I don't think that Walker or Arvin even makes pipes and stock-type mufflers for earlier Corvettes anymore.
                In Appreciation of John Hinckley

                Comment

                • Bill L.
                  Expired
                  • February 1, 2004
                  • 1403

                  #9
                  Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

                  I am going to give Gardner Exhaust a call to inquire about corvette systems. I prefer to do this once. Just as an after thought, has anyone ever approached Walker about restoration corvette exhaust or blueprints? I know they have a plant or warehouse in Virginia located in the Shanandoah Valley

                  Any thoughts on saving my exhaust tips? As I mentioned, they are currently welded to the existing muffler. I was thinking I might be able to save them by very carefully trying to grind away the extra material to get down to the original tail section of the tip.

                  How accurrate are the GM restoration bezels I see in the Paragon catalog? My other option is rechroming.

                  Will I lose any points by using reproduction shielding? I understand that maybe the chrome is too nice or can I order with the flash chrome? I do have some original pieces but they would have to be rechromed too.

                  Thank you for all the help!

                  Bill

                  Comment

                  • Joe L.
                    Beyond Control Poster
                    • February 1, 1988
                    • 43193

                    #10
                    Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

                    Bill-----

                    Once-upon-a-time, I talked to some Walker reps. They told me that their OEM business is completely separate from their aftermarket business. The parts are not even made in the same plants, except when they are making OEM parts and they are able to sell the same parts through their aftermarket channels. They also told me that even if they had the specifications for the parts, they probably would not be able to reproduce them without GM's approval. Plus, they would only be able to make them in their OEM plants and there's no way they'd do that for the kind of order size that would be involved here. Basically, they said "forget it".

                    The GM Restoration Parts licensee for just about all Corvette mufflers is Ecklers. However, Eckler's does not reproduce these mufflers. Instead, I understand they purchase their mufflers from Allen's and sell them as "GM Restoration Parts" under their license (although, as far as I know, Allen's can't do that). Allen's are very high quality, absolutely excellent exhaust parts and, as far as I'm concerned, the best on the market today. However, I think that even Mike Allen would tell you that they are not exact reproductions of the GM pieces.

                    You should be able to grind away the weld and remove and re-use the exhaust tips. I don't know why they are welded; originals were clamped.

                    As far as the bezels go, I could not tell you how good the reproductions are; I have not really examined the current offerings. However, I can tell you that your originals will be difficult to re-chrome. These bezels are zinc diecast and they are usually "pitted". These can be restored by some folks expert in this sort of work, but it's going to be very expensive since it's time consuming.
                    In Appreciation of John Hinckley

                    Comment

                    • Kent K.
                      Extremely Frequent Poster
                      • December 1, 1982
                      • 1139

                      #11
                      Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

                      Bill,

                      Your question regarding the exhaust extensions is tough to answer without more info or photos of the weldings. Generally speaking, you might consider using a Dremel tool with a cut-off blade to carefully cut through the welds and, possibly, salvedge most of the extension pipes. Then grind them to a square end. Polish the chrome and (maybe) paint the ground ends with silver paint. I have no personal experience with Paragon's 1970 exhaust extensions.

                      When it comes to reproduction shielding (here I go again speaking about something I'm not an expert), unless there is an observable configuration difference, judges may pass on deducting for the chrome quality. You could ask vendors if they would flash chrome ignition shielding. Finding NOS shielding is practicably impossible.

                      Again, on exhaust systems, Allen's made one for my '67 that cost extra shipping because of my insistance for OEM length sections. If Walker will custom build a Corvette system for you from old drawings, let us all know. I believe their facility in Shenandoah Valley is for manufacturing & shipping with no sales to individuals.

                      Happy New Year, Kent
                      Kent
                      1967 327/300 Convert. w/ Air - Duntoved in 1994
                      1969 427/435 Coupe - 1 previous owner
                      2006 Coupe - Driver & Fun Car !!!
                      NCM Founder - Member #718

                      Comment

                      • Harmon C.
                        Extremely Frequent Poster
                        • August 31, 1994
                        • 3228

                        #12
                        Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

                        Bill
                        To remove the pipe from the tips

                        Cut the exhaust tips off the pipes and leave a little pipe. Cut the welds with a wheel. On the inside of the old pipe use a die grinder with a round burr to cut the pipe but stop at the tip. With a slot cut in the old pipe you can roll the metal up and pull the pipe out.
                        Lyle
                        Lyle

                        Comment

                        • Warren F.
                          Expired
                          • December 1, 1987
                          • 1516

                          #13
                          Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

                          Bill,

                          The reproduction bezels are very nice. However if look at the back of your originals, you'll notice that they are dated with the year of manufacture, such as '69, 70, 71, 72. I have personally had my originals rechromed. Joe Lucia is correct in that it takes time to rechrome these due to pitting from the exhaust fumes. I've had 2 sets re-done, because I wanted to keep the correct dated pieces on both cars.

                          Comment

                          • Bill L.
                            Expired
                            • February 1, 2004
                            • 1403

                            #14
                            Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

                            I thank everyone for their help! Looks like I will be making a few calls after the new year.

                            Sounds like a bit of work on the tips but that is the fun part, if I can save them.

                            I will send out the bezels and tips since I like dated parts that were original to the car too. I am likely going to have my original power steering valve and cylinder rebuilt for the same reason.

                            They are in a lot better shape than most I have seen so that should help.

                            Thanks again. Bll

                            Comment

                            • Bill L.
                              Expired
                              • February 1, 2004
                              • 1403

                              #15
                              Re: 70 Exhaust System Replacement

                              Hi Guys,

                              Well all Gardner Exhaust needs is a set of original 2" exhaust pipes/mufflers and he is ready to manufacture them. He prefers to purchase the pipes outright to keep as a comparison should he receive any phone calls on a system he may have sold..

                              He said that he has reproduced the LT-1 pipes already along with the big block pipes. He also has duplicated 63-67 systems. He just installed a system on his dad's 63 and he says they are almost perfect but for some issues with some of the hardware. He is putting together a corvette website as we type.

                              Does anyone know of someone with original pipes that can provide them to Mr. Gardner?

                              This is pretty exciting news.

                              Bill

                              Comment

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