Pertronix ignition swap from points

[Todd L.]

Has anyone switched out stock points and condenser to an aftermarket electronic control like Pertronix? I am having a surging problem and a miss that we have eliminated down to the ignition system on my 300 HP 63. I want to drive this car and not have issues, so I would like to switch over to electronic but keeping the stock look under the ignition shielding. Does anyone have a recommendation or part # for what to use? I believe I will need a new module and coil?

Thanks,
Todd

[Stephen L.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

I've switched a couple of non-GM engines to pertronics without a problem....... Is your problem electric or a possible vacuum leak? You'll need to bypass the ballast resistor with a slight wiring change which can be accomplished inside the wiring harness, so that the ballast resistor can stay connected for "originality"

[Frank D.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

I've used Pertronix products since their inception, the latest version, the Ignitor III, does NOT bypass the ballast resistor.

If you have an underlying ignition problem a conversion will not fix it.
Having said that I now recommend the Breakerless SE conversion instead; EVERYthing else can remain stock with this device, plugs, plug gap, plug wires, ignition coil, ballast resistor, etc. Fully 1/2 the issues I see with the Pertronix are bum installs or mixing in incompatible components.

The Breakless SE is undetectable and will pass judging, a savvy person can spot a Pertronix install...

Again, troubleshooint a low horsepower Chevy small block ignition system in stock form is not brain surgery; I'd hate to see you throw in a conversion and still have problems unrelated to the swap.

Provide more info on your problem and many here can help, if a miss is related to a failing plug wire or plug fouling and the surging is too much advance - all of those issues can be dealt with without adding a new variable into the equation.

[Todd L.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

Thank you for the detail Frank. Here is where we are. I bought this car from a man that had it sitting in his warehouse for the last 24 years, and only started a few times. After checking things out, I found the oil was like clay and the camshaft was shot. Since that finding, the motor has been rebuilt and has been driven 11 miles since the overhaul. The carb has been rebuilt and adjusted correctly. The valves are set at 1 turn past zero lash. The timing is at 16 degrees advance. It idles ok, revs great, has plenty of power under load, but cruising at 2,000 ish RPMs in all gears it surges, hesitates, and has a miss. All vacuum hoses and lines have been replaced. The points looked new, so I just verified the gap at .016" and left them alone. The condenser was not changed, the rotor and cap were not changed as they both look like they had been changed at some point. The plugs (AC R43) and wires were replaced with new. I'm not a mechanic but have a decent understanding of a SBC, so I would welcome any advice on how to check for vacuum leaks or what may be causing this issue.

[Duke W.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

Has anyone switched out stock points and condenser to an aftermarket electronic control like Pertronix? I am having a surging problem and a miss that we have eliminated down to the ignition system on my 300 HP 63. I want to drive this car and not have issues, so I would like to switch over to electronic but keeping the stock look under the ignition shielding. Does anyone have a recommendation or part # for what to use? I believe I will need a new module and coil?

Thanks,
Todd

So why not just fix the problem you have determined with the ignition system rather that installing a "black box" that can suddenly fail without warning.

The single point system is simple, reliable, and rarely fails without warning, but it's a good idea to do a a few checks and adjustments every 10-15 thousand miles.

One of the beauties of these vintage cars is that they are SIMPLE! No black boxes, just simple electromechanical systems that you can usually troubleshoot and determine the problem with a cheap multimeter and parts are readily available and inexpensive.

Duke

[Todd L.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

I don't know what the problem is..that is what I am looking for advice on. I just thought a simple fix would be electronic ignition..

[Frank D.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

OK. First and foremost those AC43 plugs are too cold and can cause fouling - a minimum is ACR45s or NGKB4 plugs. Secondly, the typical GM SBC point gap is .019 (.016:" for used points), or about 29* of dwell and plug gap is .035". I believe the 63 300hp spec for initial timing is like 8* BTDC (the only book I have), you are way above that ...couldn't hurt to back off a couple of degrees, maybe back to 12* even, and recheck things.

Next since the car has sat so long I would take a hard look at the distributor; ensure the cap and rotor are good and no signs of arcing, cracks, etc. Then examine the electrical wire to the point breaker plate for fraying/corrosion, then check the centrifugal weights carefully for sticking and ensure the springs are seated properly. Next check the vacuum advance against Duke's 2" rule. If sounds like you have light cruise "trailer hitching" which is an indication of too much advance.

Its a pain with shielding but another check is to remove individual plug wires (with a glove) at idle speed and make sure the idle drops 50-100 RPM if any plug should fail this test its not firing for some reason. And then I would put a vacuum gauge on the car and look for any of these symptoms: https://www.onallcylinders.com/2016/...auge-readings/

You seem to have eliminated fuel but a clogged filter or rust in the tank or pump can wreak havoc on performance -- and finally check the actuator pin in the fuel pump to make sure its not "walking out"; some popular aftermarket pumps are having this problem.

[Todd L.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

Ok, thank you for that suggestion Frank!

[Patrick B.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

If the vacuum advance is working, 16* advance (measured with the vacuum advance disconnected and the hose plugged) is way too much for a 327/300. If 16* was measured with the vacuum advance connected it is much less than it should be. It should be about 5* at 700 rpm without vacuum advance, and about 25* with vacuum advance at 700 rpm. The idle speed has to be adjusted at lot to get to the 700 rpm when going from with or without vacuum advance. The spark plug gap should be .035, and the plugs should be hotter like AC 45.

[Todd L.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

Thanks Patrick, I had the advance set at 27* and took it to a restoration shop to have it "dialed in" and they said the old repair manual called for 16*. I will cap off the vacuum advance and set it to 5* and change plugs to see if that helps.

[Mark E.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

I second what Duke says. Find and fix the problem, and keep the points. Points will not suddenly fail and leave you in the lurch. And there's something about keeping an all analog car all analog.

[Duke W.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

Thanks Patrick, I had the advance set at 27* and took it to a restoration shop to have it "dialed in" au d they said the old repair manual called for 16*. I will cap off the vacuum advance and set it to 5* and change plugs to see if that helps.

Those guys are clueless. I don't know what "repair manual" those morons are quoting, but it's NOT the 1963 Corvette Shop Manual that YOU NEED TO BUY, and also download the free '63 Corvette vehicle information package from the GM Heritage Web site and read it. It's amazing how many "professionals" make good money offering incompetent advice and service.

It's unfortunate, but if you own a vintage car and don't know how to do basic maintenance like a tune-up or have a buddy who does you'll likely end up a victim.

Duke

[Tom E.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

Todd,
Just a thought, If you are having surging at cruise RPM you may have a lean fuel issue. Your Holley is running on the idle circuit till about 2000 rpm during cruise. Could be a combination so things and not just the ignition.
Tom

[Tim S.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

Is it indeed a lean surge or is it cutting out? (hence breaker plate ground wire that has a break in it)

[Jeff S.]

Re: Pertronix ignition swap from points

Todd,
Just a thought, If you are having surging at cruise RPM you may have a lean fuel issue. Your Holley is running on the idle circuit till about 2000 rpm during cruise. Could be a combination so things and not just the ignition.
Tom

Your Holley?