Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

[Greg L.]

Well I'm starting to get my ducks in a row as opposed to chasing my tail on which topcoat to use. I've been on the lacquer side of the fence for quite sometime and I'll probably stay there(sorry Chuckster) but now I'm wondering if I should also put a clear coat on.

I plan to paint the car myself(first complete ever), the color is 986 Cortez Silver and I just feel that it would be better if I have to do some light color sanding AND that it will hold up better in the long run because I have heard that silver is a hard color to keep shiney.

If I don't "pour" the clear on and just have a couple nice thin coats with no build up on the edges or lips would this warrant point deductions on paint or can the clear be applied and yet have the paint look like fresh lacquer? I've read the paint guidelines so I know that any type of paint can be used as long as it APPEARS original.

Also would the clear add any durability to the paint or would it be mostly for a buffing layer(I don't really want to color sand and buff a metalic)!

Thanks

[Dick W.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

Greg, you picked one of the worst colors to start learning about all over paint jobs. Heavy metalic colors are easy to "tiger stripe", blotch, etc.

Clear is clear when it comes to judging. If detectable it is a deduction. Look at the mixing formula for that color. It is way over 1/2 clear and binders (which are clear). Addition of more clear will be obvious. BUT it does make it easier to color sand and buff.

I would be more concerned about getting the right color than the clear.

[Chuck S.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

Greg, you picked one of the worst colors to start learning about all over paint jobs. Heavy metalic colors are easy to "tiger stripe", blotch, etc.

Clear is clear when it comes to judging. If detectable it is a deduction. Look at the mixing formula for that color. It is way over 1/2 clear and binders (which are clear). Addition of more clear will be obvious. BUT it does make it easier to color sand and buff.

I would be more concerned about getting the right color than the clear.

Yeah...Whatsamattayou?...Don't you know you'll get no credit for foolin' aroun' with lacquer if it's under clearcoat?

You want to have your lunch and eat it too...Sorry, it's decision time and there's only two choices: CHOOSE (1) Originality (Ha!) or (2) Durability.

[Kevin M.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

Originality, the paint will look good taken car of and age appropriately with the rest of the car.

Kevin

[Dick W.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

Chuckster, if you have access to mixing formulas look at some of the silver formulas. '63 Sebring Silver is close to 80% clear if you count the binders. You already have an almost clear coat anyway. In lacquer is a very poor covering color. Not a lot of solids in the formula. I think that is one of the reasons clean is so obvious on silver paint.

In the late '80's we painted a '63 with silver lacquer and NO clear coat. Had a lot of trouble convincing judges that it was not cleared. I will admit that we have cleared quite a few cars and done it in a fashion that they got by the judges, but this car was probably the last car we did with no clear.

[Chuck S.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

Chuckster, if you have access to mixing formulas look at some of the silver formulas. '63 Sebring Silver is close to 80% clear if you count the binders. You already have an almost clear coat anyway. In lacquer is a very poor covering color. Not a lot of solids in the formula. I think that is one of the reasons clean is so obvious on silver paint.

In the late '80's we painted a '63 with silver lacquer and NO clear coat. Had a lot of trouble convincing judges that it was not cleared. I will admit that we have cleared quite a few cars and done it in a fashion that they got by the judges, but this car was probably the last car we did with no clear.

Dickie, that doesn't surprise me that silver has so much clear.

But, then you have these paint judges that say, "Oh, yeah, base coat /clear coat, it's like a neon sign; it's obvious....it's deeper, you can see the difference." You're saying they're whacking your silver LACQUER cars WITHOUT clear; and it's even worse, I suppose, if you add more clear on top of the lacquer.

Essentially what Greg is asking about here is BC/CC, with the base coat being two coats of lacquer that is already largely clear. I can't see the point...why not just go modern base coat with urethane clear if you're going to do that? At least you would have something that would stand up to bird doo.

His only relief here is to maybe not clear the jambs, drip rails, etc; that might help him get some advantage out of these lacquer contortions...or not. (Need that 'No' Nod head shake icon here)

[Dick W.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

It would be a lot easier to use single stage and use a flatener in the jambs. Takes a little work on edges and other places that paint has a tendency to build up, but it can be done and the only hit taken will be over restoration. That is a hit that is almost impossible to dodge. How do you put the waves, paint runs, and in some era's the lack of paint?

[Chuck S.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

It would be a lot easier to use single stage and use a flatener in the jambs. Takes a little work on edges and other places that paint has a tendency to build up, but it can be done and the only hit taken will be over restoration. That is a hit that is almost impossible to dodge. How do you put the waves, paint runs, and in some era's the lack of paint?

That's my preference as well. Durability is not quite as good as BC/CC, but you can enhance it somewhat by mixing clear 50/50 into a third coat. On a solid color, the clear would be undetectable, but a metallic may begin to look a little like BC/CC.

But...I've tried multiple times to lead this hoss to water, and he ain't drinkin'! He sez he's on the lacquer side of the fence, but I think he's still on the sharp end of the pickets. LOL

[Alan S.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

Greg,
The fellow who painted my 71 in lacquer 3 years ago doesn't paint anything but lacquer. He paints 4-6 cars a year. He seems to be very aware of lacquer's strengths and weaknesses. My paint turned out exactly like he said it would. It's red, I asked him a hundred times (well almost) if clear would make it better. He always said NO! But he said metallics were a different story. If you would like to pick his brain contact me and I'll give you his phone number.
Regards,
Alan

PS: Of all the decisions I made during my restoration, the paint decision was by far the most difficult. I wanted it to look like it was a factory paint job but on a day when everything went just right.

[Tom L.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

I agree with Dick. That's a really tough color to cut your teeth on. The first car I ever painted was a very similar GM silver. I painted the car three times before I was happy with it.

[Patrick H.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

Greg, you picked one of the worst colors to start learning about all over paint jobs. Heavy metalic colors are easy to "tiger stripe", blotch, etc.

I would be more concerned about getting the right color than the clear.

Absolutely.

Silver is a color I'd never do myself. I'd "do a Chuck" and buy a white car if I wanted to try painting.
Easy to make silver look bad, really bad.

You might want to prep it and get it ready, but I'd do it with the guidance of a friend who is a professional painter and won't mind spraying on the color when you get to that stage.

Patrick

[Tony S.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

Clear coat over lacquer? If you're going to use a clear coat, then use BC/CC. It makes no sense to me to use lacquer under a clear coat.

JMO
Tony

[Bill W.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

I agree . silver is not a beginners color. it does not spot repair well if you screw up . Putting clear over the top will change the side tones . also silver polishes black ,clear dont. paint a practice panel like a old hood to check the color,metallic , and your ability. be sure to buff it. Remember your are not buffing a custom. dont try to make it to smooth and glossy. Bill

[Dick W.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

Bill I was hoping you or Wayne Wobble would chime in. Y'all has fergot more than I will ever learn

[Greg L.]

Re: Your thoughts on a lacquer clear coat....

Well this is embarrasing....I see that I asked the same basic question last fall. Oh well at least the answer is the same! I WILL pass on the clear.

I know that silver isn't a good color for a first time complete but I really don't have any choice in the matter. I'm also pretty sure that I'll have to do it myself because production shops only seem to want to do insurance claims and the few resto shops that I phoned want anywhere from $300-$500/hr to paint it as well as 1-3 months to complete it.

If all else fails I'll drag that car back home to Manitoba and have my buddy do it for me. This isn't his trade but man he does good work!

Alan you are right...this is by far the most diffucult decision I've had to make for my restoration.

I have a few other questions but I think I'll check my old posts first...