64-65 fuel injection part that is not typical

[Joel F.]

Re: 64-65 fuel injection part that is not typical

John,

I agree with you, but the reality is that owners are going to need to get desperate before the next generation can step in. At least in the FI space. I think you and I have had an exchange on this topic before, I am 36 and one of my cars is a 62 fuelie. I can keep it running well enough, but I do need help now and again, and am very grateful for the advice the likes of you, Jerry Bramlett and others on this board have provided.

Like I mentioned, I can keep my car running well but I am no FI guru. I'd like to be one, and may evolve into a guru someday, but for now my skills and experience are limited to the issues I have had on my car. On the same note, I try to tackle every issue I have, but again, in the future, I am likely to only see a small number of the potential issues an FI unit could have.

In this light, how can the next generation of would be restorers get the experience to really know these things, and also be able to develop these skills into a business? If I knew another FI owner who'd let me work on his car, I'd do it for free. But alas, I do not know anyone like that. Hell, I have never even seen another FI car at a cruise in or show in my area, much less one where the owner needed some helps with the unit. And it isn't like I can credibly offer my services in the Restorer, because my experience does not hold a candle to yours, so who would send me their unit? The problem is that these aren't just cars anymore. There aren't that many left, and those that are don't get played with and driven like they might have even just 20 years ago.

So I will continue to play with my car and slowly gain experience as any old car owner does, and by the time I have any expertise, most FI cars will be museum pieces, and gasoline will be $20 a gallon.

Anyway, I don't have any solutions, but rather an explanation.

Joel

[John D.]

Re: 64-65 fuel injection part that is not typical

Robert, You are 100% correct. An old Quadrajet is harder than an FI anyday. Even worse is working on a Holley. I used to rebuild a ton of RP carbs though in the olden days. The hardest ones were the tri-power especially the end carbs. If you didn't have a chemical called Dap (SP) that you used on the throttle plates to seal them the things wouldn't idle for crap. Yes FI's are easier but fellows are scared of them for some reason. Reason is they don't read the theory in the manuals. If you don't know the theory and you attempt to fix one you are in deep trouble. I still read the ST12 manual theory section. It's the best one. Better than the 63 manual for sure. Course you know that. Surprised though Robert that you don't know about poor old JD's rare base plate. Slippin in old age. JD

[Joel F.]

Re: 64-65 fuel injection part that is not typical

John, I agree the ST12 theory section is good, but me thinks there is more to it than that little bit of theory.

[Jimmy B.]

Re: 64-65 fuel injection part that is not typical

Talk to Mr. Futo, he owns at least one like this, has been seen in the past.

[John D.]

Re: 64-65 fuel injection part that is not typical

Joel, Trouble with the old FI units is that they have a mind of there own somethings. So they require a lot of patience. Biggest problem with them I have found is butcher work. Bubba work to use a favorite term on the DB. Your 62 is an excellent unit except for the wild choke and once you get past that you have it made. I see no reason why you and others can't master such a basic fuel injection unit. But it is a lot more than turning the screw driver and putting a rebuild kit. But don't give up as you seem to be focused. Another problem we have lately is a lot of the FI builders aren't taking on any more work because they are getting smart. THey are also getting up in years and realize they have served the world long enough and want to restore their old Corvettes and have some fun before they pass on like so many of their pals. Good luck, John D.

[John D.]

Re: 64-65 fuel injection part that is not typical

Hi Jimmy, I have the answer to the mystery base plate. I got the correct terminology from John Hinckley and the rest of the info from Ken Kayser.
The 64-65 (also fits 63) baseplate in question is made up of two molds. The cope and the drag. (JH words) Now the type of mold used is called the infinite life mold. (KK words) Ken said there is finite-fixed time length molds and infinite-last a long time molds. Typically Winters foundry used the infinite. So along comes a worker who spots a nice infinite type mold that is probably called the drag (might be the cope though as JH didn't tell me which is which). THe drag mold is dated 2 -3-64 EJ. But here it is one year later and the foundry worker is using an old drag but with a new cope. So he had to date the new cope with 2/2/65. So then the part ends up with two dates. Makes sense. Now since I have owned at least three of these and Brian Futo has at least one the worker must have made a large run of these all in the same day of course. That explains the not so typical baseplate. We at NCRS seeing parts like this on a car may not except it as the real deal and that is where good judgement comes into play.
Thanks John and Ken for your help. I have been wondering about this casting for many years. John D.
P.S. At least 15-20 years ago I restored a 65 FI for a fellow named Joe in NY. I told him that his baseplate had to be a replacement cause it had two different dates on it. He argued that no way John. Joe said that part came on his car from day one. Joe is the one that got me started using aviation fuel. I believe it must be 20 years by now. Time does fly. So guys and girls don't get excited if you see one of these critters on the judging field.

[James G.]

Re: 64-65 fuel injection part that is not typical

John, I saw on VETTEHEADS last eve JH's answer to what he thought was two molds were used. A top mold and a bottom mold, and obviously the top mold was newer by about a year. You would think 65 FI cars made after 2-2-65 (approx vin #8450) would all have the newer dated rare part you are discussing.

Maybe a disgruntled union employee wanted 'his' mark on an item. All along he new an anal NCRS GUY would get finally recognize his legacy.

[John D.]

Re: 64-65 fuel injection part that is not typical

Jim, Maybe a hand ful of them have this part. But right now I am restoring a 65 FI that has a 3-25-65 baseplate. So the word ALL wouldn't apply. Some might be a another way of putting it. Take care, John