Frame paint

[Michael L.]

I'm getting ready to order the frame paint from Quanta and I'm somewhat confused about what to get. I have always heard that the paint should be semi-gloss, but they recommend a medium black for the frame, with semigloss being for brackets and some suspension components such as A-arms. The medium they have is 50% gloss. Does anyone have experience with this product? Is the medium what I should be using on the frame?

Also, I have read in the archives about the A-arms being semigloss and slightly different from the frame. This would make what they are saying seem correct. Does anyone have a complete list of items that should be semigloss vs. the medium black of the frame?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Mike

[Chuck S.]

Re: Frame paint

In my experience, the term "semi-gloss" is used indiscriminately by many for every part painted black on the chassis. The original GM black primer used was closer to "satin" or "eggshell" gloss.

"Medium" black makes no sense at all for black paint..."medium" is typically used for hue, like "medium" green or "medium" blue. Black is black...well, at least it is for these purposes. Quanta intends "medium" black for "medium gloss" black, but only they understand what gloss level that terminology implies, so don't be discouraged if you can't picture it.

Semi-gloss is probably a pretty good description of the gloss on the control arms; the frame should have slightly less gloss. Gloss on frames will vary from semi-flat to almost semi-gloss.

If you've ever painted PPG DP90LF, the gloss level for that product is almost perfect for frames, just slightly too flat...better to top coat the DP90LF with acrylic enamel flattened to a gloss level somewhere between the DP90LF and the control arms. I can't tell you how to do it, just that you should know it when you see it (fully dry)...flattening paint is an art rather than an inexact science.

[Robert D.]

Re: Frame paint

i ordered both from quanta in the quart size and found them to be almost the same.
they come prethinned? depending on temp and pressure i found the look of the gloss changed.
i am not a pro like chuck and some of the other guys but i do have time with a spray gun and found this paint to run very easy so be careful.
the other thing is for a satin (or semiflat) finish i found kyrlon semiflat black to be a very good option.
i sprayed the frame in the quanta 50% medium gloss and the a-arms in krylon semi-flat which was much easier to handle for me.
my car was flight judged and the gloss level was not an issue

[Chuck S.]

Re: Frame paint

...i am not a pro like chuck...

HaHaHa... There're some "pros" on this forum, but I ain't one of them. Pros get paid for the work they do...IF I ever DID any work, I'm so slow, no one else but me could afford my "hourly rate". And that doesn't mean I'm rich...it means, when working for myself, I work for nothing. HaHaHa...

Learn the gloss levels you need, then buy automotive acrylic black enamel. You'll get better durability and full technical information on the manufacturer's product sheets.

In the past, Dickie has recommended PPG Deltron 9300...I've used it as well. Flatten it to the gloss level you need for the application using PPG's universal flattener, DX85(?). It's a trial and error process...there's a product sheet for the DX85 that gives you approximate flattener volume required, but I've found it's still a crap shoot. For a corrosion resistant primer, apply PPG DP90LF first as a base. If you've got a spray gun, you can do it...we're not talking BC/CC here. But...be sure you wear breathing protection, preferably a fresh breathing air system...catalyzed paints will kill you.

The reason your Quanta paint is running is, it may be "pre-thinned", but unless the manufacturer knows what ambient temperature you will be spraying in, they can't reduce paint in advance without problems.

Reducers are blended for a given temperature range...for spraying in colder ambient temperatures, you use a "hotter" or "lighter" reducer that flashes easily; for warmer temperatures, you use a "colder" or "heavier" reducer that flashes less easily. You want the paint to stay liquid long enough to flow out well for good gloss and smooth finish, and then you want the reducer to flash out so the curing process can begin before runs form. If you get your reducer "too cold", it doesn't flash out fast enough, the paint stays liquid longer, and that results in runs.

If you're using good materials, and have your reducer matched to the ambient temperature, you can minimize runs by misting a light "bond coat" first, and then apply subsequent coats as full wet coats for high gloss (when desireable).

[Michael L.]

Re: Frame paint

Thanks guys. This has been very helpful. Since there was variability in the factory original finish I don't think I'm going to sweat the small stuff and worry about the degree of gloss too much. The medium is listed as 50% gloss and will go with that on the frame and the 65% semigloss for most of the other chassis/suspension components.

Mike

[Stewart A.]

Re: Frame paint

Chuck what year Corvette do you have. I would love to see the paint work on it. Sounds like it would be a work of art.

[Chuck S.]

Re: Frame paint

Chuck what year Corvette do you have. I would love to see the paint work on it. Sounds like it would be a work of art.

I have a 70 coupe under restoration, but it's not painted yet. I could show you an SUV I painted in the same paint system as the Vette will have except it's red. It looks like it's made of red glass.

[Stewart A.]

Re: Frame paint

Chuck what method of paint enhancement do you use after the car has been painted e.g blocking back with 1500 or 2000 to remove peel and so forth and polish methods.

[Chuck S.]

Re: Frame paint

Chuck what method of paint enhancement do you use after the car has been painted e.g blocking back with 1500 or 2000 to remove peel and so forth and polish methods.

Sorry, Stewart, I missed your post...I generally only check page 1 for new posts. I guess we had a busy weekend.

Keep in mind my comments are about final finishing of single-stage acrylic urethane...that's what I used to paint my old SUV and what I plan to use on my Corvette as well The SUV was the training dress reheasal for the Vette.

Correct any runs, boogers, dust nibs before you start sanding. You can buy a run file on a small block about 1" square; they come in about three different finish grades. If you work carefully without digging the corners in (not easy on a concave curved surface), you bring a run, booger, or dust nib right down to perfectly level.

With a lot of coarse, non-uniform orange peel, minor runs, boogers, and dirt (sounds like a trainee, huh?), I found the work went faster starting with 1000 grit, then resanding again with 1500. Don't use a hard block for finish sanding...you should block for panel straightness at the primer level.

When color sanding with fine grit sandpaper, you should use a foam sanding pad that conforms to the body curvature and prevents finger grooving. After you have reduced the 1000 grit scratches to 1500 scratches, you'll be done once you buff out the sand scratches.

I had 2000 grit sandpaper on hand when I color sanded the SUV, but never used it...until you learn what you're doing, starting with 1500 and then 2000 is a lot more work, but safer...2000 grit scratches will also buff out much quicker.

I don't like worrying about burning my paint with a rotary buffer, and I'm too old to burn my paint learning how to use one. I only use a Porter Cable 7424 random orbital polisher with 3M Perfect-It II liquid rubbing compound on a Lake Country cutting foam pad (yellow).

Now, the PC 7424 is the ultimate gentle polisher...I haven't deliberately tried to burn my paint , but I believe it's impossible to do with the PC. In spite of that, the PC will buff out 1500 scratches in a couple of compound applications. Overlap passes north-south, then east-west, then on the diagonals...once your compound is pretty much gone, apply more compound and repeat. It takes a little longer with the PC, but you have no worries about buffer damage.

After the rubbing compound brings the gloss about 80-90 percent of the way, I finish it the rest of the way with 3M Foam Pad Glaze on a "white" polishing pad.