Starter Number & Dates 1971

[Paul C.]

I have a Jan 28, 1971 350, 4 speed with a starter #1108338---July 9, 1970 --just outside 6 months. Judging manual says 1108338 early and 1108418 later. What is early and late? The reason I ask is because I have a July 24, 1970 starter #1108418---but it is also 4 days outside 6 months. Would I lose points on either starter and what was considered early and late in the production year.
Thanks Paul

[Joe L.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

I have a Jan 28, 1971 350, 4 speed with a starter #1108338---July 9, 1970 --just outside 6 months. Judging manual says 1108338 early and 1108418 later. What is early and late? The reason I ask is because I have a July 24, 1970 starter #1108418---but it is also 4 days outside 6 months. Would I lose points on either starter and what was considered early and late in the production year.
Thanks Paul

Paul-----


Well, either of the starters is outside the NCRS and NCCB "6 month window". In most cases, the "6 month window" is very generous. Usually, the time span between starter build date and car build date will be more like 1-2 months, sometimes even less than a month. So, I'd look for a starter of EITHER part number that has a date within 2 months of your car's build date. That starter could have been used on your car. My HUNCH is that the 1108338 was not used too far into the 1971 model year and you MAY not even be able to find one dated within 2 months of your car's build date.

I don't think there's anything definitive on when the change-over occurred; it might not even have been a discrete date as there could have been "overlapping" use.

So, what's the difference between these starters? Well, the 1108338 is a "standard" torque starter; the 1108418 is a "high torque" starter. So, if I was you, I'd be looking for an 1108418 THAT REMAINS IN ITS ORIGINAL HIGH TORQUE CONFIGURATION. Of course, you could always even use an 1108338 that's been converted to high torque but then its EXTERNAL configuration would not be exactly correct.

[Mike E.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

I did a dating game article in the Restorer several years ago--you might want to reference that, because the primary focus was on a 71. That was a VERY original LT-1 car, immediately post-strike, #2485, built the last week of November. The original starter was still on that car, and it was an 8418, dated 0F10 Hope that helps--you definitely need an 8418.
Regards,
Mike

[Kevin G.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

An example for you..........my 08555, G02 (Feb.2nd 71) has a 1/15/71 starter.(1108400 bb car)

Regards,

Kevin

[Paul C.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

Kevin is your starter a #1108338 or a 1108418?

[Kevin G.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

Kevin is your starter a #1108338 or a 1108418?

Paul, It's a big block car, and has the 1108400 starter.

[Jack H.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

Most all of the published literature says 1971 cars used the '418 starter and my April built SB had it's factory original '338 starter, dated 'B 71' on when I began the restoration. So, I left it and did some research.

I found MF Dobbins was one of the few sources that said there were early vs. late starters... Later, I'd find the change is documented in the 1972 AIM where there's an ECR record calling out the new '418 starter to superceed the '338 unit. Based on that + input(s) to the 1970-72 National Team Leader, our Judging Guide was changed to reflect 'early vs. late'.

If I remember correctly, the ECR was dated something like the first week of July 1971. That would set the first time the later '418 starter MIGHT have been in-house on the assy line. But, in cases of running changes like these, we never know how much inventory was on hand of the 'early' part that would result in mixed production going out the door...

Bottom line, in this case the 'early' part was used VERY late into the model year build and that's why the terms 'early' and 'late' need to be researched before you decide which is right for your restoration. You have to take each running change on a part by part basis!

[Paul C.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

I agree with you Jack late should be better defined if possible. I have talked to several more owners who have cars from 1971. Dates are as follows on their starters:
338ecember 10, 1970, March 10, 1971

[Mike E.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

To help confuse things, I just documented a VERY original, but tired, 71 LT-1 convertible. This car just hasn't been messed with. It is a 4200 serial number car, and has an 8338 starter, dated 0M11 It's pretty obvious to me that they were interchanging these over a period of time--just don't know exactly when they first introduced the 8418, and when they last used the 8338.

[Greg F.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

I have a 71 small block.

Engine date is Feb 9th 1971

Car was built Feb 16th 1971

Starter is 8338....O J 3 4 (Sept 3, 1970).

[Dave S.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

I have been trying to clarify this 338/418 starter thing for awhile. My July 8, 1970 LT-1 has a 418 starter with a July 3, 1970 date. It is original to the car but conflicts with the Judging Guide. As the date lines up with the car it has always properly recieved full credit on the judging field. My May 11, 1971 LT-1 also has a 418 starter with an April 29, 1971 date. Hopefully the next 70-72 Judging Guide will clarify this starter thing a bit more.

[Joe L.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

I have been trying to clarify this 338/418 starter thing for awhile. My July 8, 1970 LT-1 has a 418 starter with a July 3, 1970 date. It is original to the car but conflicts with the Judging Guide. As the date lines up with the car it has always properly recieved full credit on the judging field. My May 11, 1971 LT-1 also has a 418 starter with an April 29, 1971 date. Hopefully the next 70-72 Judging Guide will clarify this starter thing a bit more.

Dave-----


It may very well be that the GM #1108418, being a high torque starter, was used on all or most LT-1's. GM may have figured that due to its higher compression (at least, for 1970), a higher torque starter was required or advisable. By the same token, I don't know why a high torque starter would have been used on any base engine 1970-72. The standard torque GM #1108338 was used on base engine 1969-70 Corvettes and why GM would have seen a need to use the high torque 1108418 starter on base engine 71-72's, I do not know.

The GM #1108338 was once available through the Delco parts system, but never the GM parts system. On the other hand, the GM #1108418 was once available through the GM parts system, but never through Delco.

Both starters were discontinued from SERVICE in the very early 70's and replaced by the GM #1108400, which is a high torque starter.

The thing that's always perplexed me is why there existed both the 1108418 and the 1108400. As far as I can tell, these were identical starters in all respects and I can find no functional difference between them. But, there must have been some difference. Having thought about it for years, I came up with one possibility:

1968-74 big blocks require that one of the solenoid attachment screws be extra long to accommodate the barrel nut which secures one end of the solenoid shield. It MAY be that was the difference between the 1108400, used in PRODUCTION primarily for big blocks, and the 1108418 used in PRODUCTION primarily for small blocks. In SERVICE, the extra long screw would not have been necessary for small blocks, but it wouldn't have hurt anything, either. The thing is, it wouldn't have really hurt anything in PRODUCTION if the 1108400 had been used on small blocks. So, I don't know what to think.

[Dave S.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

Joe,
Just to add more confusion. My 71 base engine/auto built on July 12, 1971 has a 1108430 starter dated June 25, 1971. It's a low mileage car so I'm 99% sure its original to the car.

[Jim T.]

Re: Starter Number & Dates 1971

My original owner 1970 350/300 still has the original starter. Has 1108430 stamping and 0F17 date code. My 70 has the same date code on the trim tag as Dave Stricklands, July 08,1970.
Original owner 68 327/350 original starter has #1108361 stamping and A825 stamping.