Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

[John N.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Dick and Duke
Thanks

[Stuart F.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Alright you cubic inch whiz kids; I ran a 57 Bel Air post in the late 50's early 60's which I built .060" over and, as the crank needed some serious clean up, so it was ground .030" off center and I used undersize bearings with special pistons to suit. After they allowed us to run 4-speeds, and I finally figured out truck heads wouldn't hack it, I got it down into the low 13's @ 106 mph with bald 2 sizes over Goodyear Double Eagles (and some chassis mods for weight transfer). Now what displacement was I at with that one? Those were the days that tear down inspections consisted of using a metal ruler to measure bore and stroke. They finally deceided my matched ports were a bit better than factory (darn sand blasting didn't clean up the grind marks).

Stu Fox

[Michael H.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Alright you cubic inch whiz kids; I ran a 57 Bel Air post in the late 50's early 60's which I built .060" over and, as the crank needed some serious clean up, so it was ground .030" off center and I used undersize bearings with special pistons to suit. After they allowed us to run 4-speeds, and I finally figured out truck heads wouldn't hack it, I got it down into the low 13's @ 106 mph with bald 2 sizes over Goodyear Double Eagles (and some chassis mods for weight transfer). Now what displacement was I at with that one? Those were the days that tear down inspections consisted of using a metal ruler to measure bore and stroke. They finally deceided my matched ports were a bit better than factory (darn sand blasting didn't clean up the grind marks).

Stu Fox

297.708 cu. in. (corrected)

[Stuart F.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Michael;

Now you know why I didn't brag about my big engine. Whooa! A whopping 298 cu in (rounded up). Impressive!

I must confess, my best performance with that car was using a set of Caddy El Dorado WCFB's. Nice Carbs; had air adjustment idle screws, 4-1-1/8" venturis and 1/8" larger throttle bores than the Corvette carbs, ran both primaries together (2 stage progressive rather than 3), and used aluminum adapter plates. I could usually change them out in about 5 minutes in the pits when I got into top speed eliminator run offs for money. We would usually start out in second due to the greater torque with these carbs and get a better top speed run (just shy of 110 mph). The downside was if you didn't come off the line just right it would start hopping which would usually break a rotor - very impressive!

Stu fox

[Joe L.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

All-----


All things being equal, I don't think a '301' will run significantly better or rev higher than a 283. The big advantage to a '301' is that the 4" bore size allows the use of later 327 heads. With other mods, including a "30-30" cam, one ends up with an engine very close in configuration to the 1967 302. However, the bottom end is not as stout as a 1968 or 69 302. The 1969 302 had, of course, the stoutest bottom end of any 302 GM ever built.

[Michael H.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Michael;

Now you know why I didn't brag about my big engine. Whooa! A whopping 298 cu in (rounded up). Impressive!

There were some pretty incredible small inch small blocks running around in the late 50's/early 60's before the new 327 became available. There's more to HP than cubic inches.
Increasing HP is basically accomplished by one of two methods. Increase cubic inches or twist the engine higher. (which is actually another way of adding cubic inches)

One question I have on the stroke of your engine is... was the actual stroke increased by .030" or .060"?
If the crankshaft pin was offset ground .030", that would result in a .060" stroke increase. (that's the factor I used to calculate your engine size)
Or was it ground .015" offset which would result in a .030" stroke increase? (more likely)

[Stuart F.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Michael;

You had me going for a moment. I had to pause and think it through to overcome that twing of doubt. Yes, .030" offset would give you .030" down and another .030" up for a total of .060", right?

I'm in the process of going through a lot of old car stuff that I've been dragging around the country on our last 4 moves since 1995, and I hope to locate the Dyno info on that car. We used to go to a place in Chicago and spend an hour on the chassis dyno to "Power Tune" our cars for street and strip. I had timing marks (lines) painted on my crank balancer for when I had the air cleaners off, lake plugs open, and one mark for the Vette carbs, and another for the Caddy carbs. Then I had one more relaxed street timing mark for cleaners on, plugs closed with the Vette carbs. My routine SOP at the strip was to remove the cleaners and lake plugs, make one "clean out" run, then change to a new set of Champion Spark Plugs, set the timing and adjust tire pressures. Then I would just sit and watch the competition, and wait for eliminations. I would make mental notes on who was fast and be prepared for when we faced off. I guess you could say I was one of the original bracket racers. I was racing against them and not the clock. The prize was the cash booty that came with stock eliminator or top speed stock, and I got my share w/o being protested until very late in the season (some smart kid with Daddy's money).

Stu Fox

[Steven B.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Michael;

You had me going for a moment. I had to pause and think it through to overcome that twing of doubt. Yes, .030" offset would give you .030" down and another .030" up for a total of .060", right?

I'm in the process of going through a lot of old car stuff that I've been dragging around the country on our last 4 moves since 1995, and I hope to locate the Dyno info on that car. We used to go to a place in Chicago and spend an hour on the chassis dyno to "Power Tune" our cars for street and strip. I had timing marks (lines) painted on my crank balancer for when I had the air cleaners off, lake plugs open, and one mark for the Vette carbs, and another for the Caddy carbs. Then I had one more relaxed street timing mark for cleaners on, plugs closed with the Vette carbs. My routine SOP at the strip was to remove the cleaners and lake plugs, make one "clean out" run, then change to a new set of Champion Spark Plugs, set the timing and adjust tire pressures. Then I would just sit and watch the competition, and wait for eliminations. I would make mental notes on who was fast and be prepared for when we faced off. I guess you could say I was one of the original bracket racers. I was racing against them and not the clock. The prize was the cash booty that came with stock eliminator or top speed stock, and I got my share w/o being protested until very late in the season (some smart kid with Daddy's money).

Stu Fox

Stu, I used to mark my balancer, too, but did it with a punch---1 dot, 2 dots, 3 dots. Worked very well until I changed cams. Just glad I had removed the stock balancer and did it to a replacement. I tried timing mark tapes but lost alot of them.

[Michael H.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Stu, I used to mark my balancer, too, but did it with a punch---1 dot, 2 dots, 3 dots. Worked very well until I changed cams. Just glad I had removed the stock balancer and did it to a replacement. I tried timing mark tapes but lost alot of them.

A real easy way to do this is with a piece of masking tape, marked with the desired total advance point/degree.
If you have an 8" balancer, multiply 8 times PI, to obtain the circumference of the outer ring. (25.132")
Divide by the number of degrees in a circle, 360, and you have the distance between degrees. (0.069")
Multiply by the number of degrees you want for total advance, such as 36*. (2.513") (or any other total advance desired)
Make two marks on a piece of masking tape 2.513" apart and apply the tape to the outer ring of the balancer, aligning one mark with the existing TDC line on the ring.
The other mark should be below, or in a clockwise direction from the zero line/mark. (advance is in the opposite direction of that on the engines existing timing plate)
With the engine at high RPM, (all advance in) adjust the distributor until the 2nd line on the tape aligns with the "0" line on the timing tab.

[Stuart F.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Michael;

Thanks for the information. I will make a note of that.

Stu Fox

[Steven B.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Thanks Michael! I used to use the adhesive backed tapes that covered the circumference of the balancer then make my marks because everytime I used the tape it would come off after a day or so---probably because I did not clean the balancer well enough

I like your method!

Steve

[Timothy B.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Mike's method is probably better but you could put the car in forth gear and rock it to align the timing marks then rock it backwards to the 12* mark, then mark the balancer with a pencil and do it two more times using the timing cover as the guage to 36*.

Whenever timing the engine for total advance, I remove the centrifugal springs in the distributor so the engine does not need to be reved high to achieve full advance and after timing just replace them.

[Stuart F.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Tim;

Thanks. Some more great ideas. But tell me; Am I the only one who aligns his timing marks (rotates the engine) using the fan belt? I've done that for as long as I have had Chevy V8's - some, of course, are easier than others, specially if you have a good amount of belt to grip and that it is on the left side so you can see your marks. My 63 is on the right which is not quite as handy. Also, to save wear and tear on the hands, it's best to use plain leather work gloves and, maybe to do the major amount of rotation, using the starter.

Stu Fox

[Timothy B.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Stu,
I usually tap tap tap with the starter then put the car in forth and rock if I need to mark anything. Just make sure the key is off, you have heard of murphies law!!

[Michael H.]

Re: Building a 283 to 301 stroker.

Mike's method is probably better but you could put the car in forth gear and rock it to align the timing marks then rock it backwards to the 12* mark, then mark the balancer with a pencil and do it two more times using the timing cover as the guage to 36*.

Timothy....

There's definitely a problem with your method if you're trying to do this on a 62, 63 or early 64 with 8" balancer. (if it has the correct original timing chain cover)
I wrote about this problem right here on this board several months ago. Anyone remember it?