Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

[Terry M.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

The Bloomington Gold standard is "Factory authentic .. no better, no worse." Bloomington Gold judges are encouraged to study original, unmolested Corvettes to acquire knowledge of factory authenticity. Owners can do the same.

[Mike M.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

Hi Charlie, good seeing you in Kissimmee.
The judging allowance is 36 minutes per car X 10 cars = 360 minutes.
NCCB Judging starts at 8:00 a.m and scheduled to finish by 3:00 p.m. with and hour for lunch.
Typically, the C-2 teams finish around 1-2p.m.
Ideally, each judge takes about 6-8 minutes for the actual judging of their section, the rest of the time is waiting for and conducting the review with the owner and the operations check is perfomd by the team.
HaND.

[Bill C.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

So if you have a base/cc paint job that judges wihtout major deductions at NCRS you will auto fail with Bloomington?

What standards do they use for judging exteriors?

[Chris E.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

The Bloomington Gold standard is "Factory authentic .. no better, no worse." Bloomington Gold judges are encouraged to study original, unmolested Corvettes to acquire knowledge of factory authenticity. Owners can do the same.

Terry, thanks for the clarification. I would point out, however, that the availability of "original, unmolested Corvettes" is not that high. Therefore, owners wishing to learn about how well their car will do at BG will have a really tough time. Plus, at $400 per learning event (the cost for BG judging, nevermind the transit, hotel and other related costs) is pretty steep.

You'd think they'd want to make it more accessible to pull in more revenue....

[Patrick H.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

So if you have a base/cc paint job that judges wihtout major deductions at NCRS you will auto fail with Bloomington?

What standards do they use for judging exteriors?

Bill,

I believe that the BG standard is the obvious use of BC/CC. This is similar to NCRS, and if attempts are made to have the paint "appear as" lacquer you willl still be eligible for a Gold.

Patrick

[Terry M.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

Chris,

I don't want to appear to be the spokesman for Bloomington Gold, they have others for that, but ...

They do have a judging event called Survivor that takes place on the day before Certification. The Survivor event is basically for original unmolested Corvettes at least 20-years old. Obviously one does not have a chance to make too many changes overnight, but one can attend and look at the Survivor cars for as many years as one wishes before bringing a car for Certification.

Of course one can also look at NCRS BowTie cars. Now given the details of a particular car, it is possible to look for a long time before one finds an original example with all the details of the car in question. Networking in forums like this, and a few others, can increase ones chances of finding that similar original car. And of course one can take details from various cars to use in ones restoration. This is called research, and we all do it in order to learn the details that move us.

I don't think there is any place that will hand one a step-by-step for every situation, but there are a variety of venues that can help build ones reference material. It is not easy, nor is it inexpensive in terms of time or money.

Contact the Bloomington Gold office through their web site for judging standards. www.bloomingtongold.com has judging information and FAQ, and contact details. They do have material about their judging process that they can send to you if you request it.

[James C.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

1971 Corvette 454/4 speed. 92.0 NCRS, 92.0 Bloomington. A lot of the same judges for both. I think the NCRS judging sheets are a bit more helpful than Bloomingtons. Just my opinion.
I have been working to get my car to Top Flight. It is very costly to chase the additional points, cause a lot of the parts on a 1971 were one year only, and many folks are competing for the priveledge to pay exorbinant prices for them. Jim

[Jack H.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

IF there's a detectable difference, you're reading the NCCB score sheets correctly... The car is 'boxed out' from receiving Gold Certification...

[Chris E.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

Terry,
Thanks for the info. I asked for the judging score sheets for 67, and received a VERY prompt reply from Bloomington Gold (sent it last night around 8pm, had a response before 10am today).

I was just trying to understand if I prepare my car towards a Duntov award for NCRS, how can I understand what things I'll need to do in ADDITION to that to get Gold at Bloomington.

My car is just now going back together, and if there are things I need to be doing that ARE NOT spelled out in the NCRS manuals that the BG judges look for, I'd like to know about them. I'm mainly concerned about big things that are hard to fix, like ball joints or carpet. I'm less concerned about things that are easily pulled off the car and fixed (like tires/wheels, air cleaner, ignition shielding, etc).

Chris

[Jack H.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

Other than the differences in judging objective that I outlined (NCRS: as delivered, NCCB: as manufactured) and the issue of 'boxed' items, the two organizations work pretty much alike.

NCCB does not have Judging Guide books like NCRS and they rely totally on the judge's personal knowledge. But, like NCRS, individual scoring call CAN be appealed and I've even used NCRS judging reference materials to support my position sucessfully!

About 50% of the judges you'll encounter at NCCB are also senior NCRS judges. So, there's little mystery as to how the process works at Bloomington...

[Ridge K.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

Very interesting, and informative thread.
One question to anyone who has worked as a judge recently at Bloomington:

The comment was made that those you prepare themselves as judges, and provide this service, "do it for the love of the cars".
Is it true, that Bloomington judges are compensated financially, for their time spent in judging Corvettes?
No criticism here,...just wanting an understanding of the facts.
Thanks in advance. Ridge.

[Jack H.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

Yes, but the NCCB judge's compensation is rather minor. I wouldn't worry about that being a negative factor impacting the outcome of a given car's final score...

[Dick W.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

Very interesting, and informative thread.
One question to anyone who has worked as a judge recently at Bloomington:

The comment was made that those you prepare themselves as judges, and provide this service, "do it for the love of the cars".
Is it true, that Bloomington judges are compensated financially, for their time spent in judging Corvettes?
No criticism here,...just wanting an understanding of the facts.
Thanks in advance. Ridge.

Ridge, a mear pittance that will not pay for a room at the host motel. I would venture to say that it costs some judges a thousand dollars or more over the spiff to judge there. All for the love of the hobby

[Ridge K.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

Ridge, a mear pittance that will not pay for a room at the host motel. I would venture to say that it costs some judges a thousand dollars or more over the spiff to judge there. All for the love of the hobby

Thanks Jack and Dick, for the replies.
It appears it's "as it should be", where the love of the cars we all share, takes center stage.
Thanks again, Ridge.

[Patrick H.]

Re: Bloomington Gold / NCRS Top Flight

Thanks Jack and Dick, for the replies.
It appears it's "as it should be", where the love of the cars we all share, takes center stage.
Thanks again, Ridge.

Yes, but when it costs judges that much to attend, and Bloomington itself is a corporation charging hundreds of $ per car, I would much rather see them compensated more fairly for there time. I know there are judges who have quit because it financially is not viable to attend and judge each year.

Patrick