CJ-4 versus CF-2

[Duke W.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

Attached, please find pertinent Specification Sheets for Chevron API Service Grade CJ-4 (in both 15W-40 and 10W-30 weights), SL, and CF-2.

The fourth product - SAE 5W-20 - data does not list an API certification and the P level exceeds the SM limit.

Is this product sold in North America?

What is the actual link to the pdf?

The Chevron products sites are "world sites" so you have to select the USA/Canada region for products that are sold here.

Products for other regions often have different formulations to meet local technical or administrative requirements and may not carry API certifications.

Duke

[Duke W.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

Duke

I read your responses to the various oil related questions and must confess that I am in a bit of a fog as to what the bottom line reccomendation from you is with respect to which oil to use in the older Corvette engines. The technical nature of the discussions is interesting but confusing to us novices and I wonder if you can simply provide a bottom line reccomendation for the suggested oil type, SAE and retail source so that I can just go buy what I need and get to work changing the oil that probably needs it! Thanks

The simple answer is in last summer's The Corvette Restorer engine oil article - near the end, but it is not brand specfic. Brand in not important.

Maybe someone else will answer your question directly, and maybe they might even get it right. If not, I will intercede.

Why am I not answering the question directly? ...because of the story of the man and the fish:

If I give a man to fish, he eats for a day. If I teach a man to fish he eats for a lifetime.

I've spent a lot of time on this board and in The Corvette Restorer teaching all how to fish, but most seem to be still starving.

Duke

[Patrick H.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

Patrick - go to http://www.chevrondelo.com/en/products/default.asp Select the region on the LH menu panel, check "products data", then "go'.

This will yield a list of links to all the Delo spec sheets, and most if not all these pdfs list the P concentration and other analysis data on the second page.

I'm not sure if the Shell and Mobil sites have as comprehensive data on their products, which is why I refer most to the Delo site if they are looking for detailed analysis specs for various C-category oils.

If you don't bookmark or remember the above link, just google Chevron Delo.

The link you listed is very informative. All should read, however, the FAQ section is specifically geared to diesel operators, so the questions and answers may not be specifically applicable to vintage spark ignition engines.

Chevron, Shell, and Mobil have spent decades (more than some of us have been around) building their commercial/diesel lubricant products brands. It's a huge market and the competition is fierce. If every vintage car owner who wants "nothing but the best" for their car we to simultaneously switch to any of the above manufacturers' diesel brands, they probably wouldn't even see a blip on ther sales charts. So don't expect any of the above marketers to advertise to us. We have to rely on our own resources and expertise to ferret out the best lubrication products for vintage cars.

Duke

OK. Found them - I had actually found them before, but didn't see the numbers on the second page of the pdfs. Duh.

[Nick M.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

I've always been a patient fisherman but the waters are now overstocked with contaminated bounty

I didn't think this board or this organization for that matter, was big on hiding the marble under the cup but rather prided itself on member helping member, not setting each other up on a fishing expedition.

[Duke W.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

OK. Found them - I had actually found them before, but didn't see the numbers on the second page of the pdfs. Duh.

Okay, you never get to do an endoscopy on me, my friend.

Duke

[Duke W.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

I've always been a patient fisherman but the waters are now overstocked with contaminated bounty

I didn't think this board or this organization for that matter, was big on hiding the marble under the cup but rather prided itself on member helping member, not setting each other up on a fishing expedition.

Well, if you're such a good fisherman and helpful guy, why didn't you answer his question instead of ranting?

Duke

[Joe C.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

The fourth product - SAE 5W-20 - data does not list an API certification and the P level exceeds the SM limit.

Is this product sold in North America?

What is the actual link to the pdf?

The Chevron products sites are "world sites" so you have to select the USA/Canada region for products that are sold here.

Products for other regions often have different formulations to meet local technical or administrative requirements and may not carry API certifications.

Duke

Duke,

The Spec Sheet attached .doc file has been amended, above, by changing the SM motor oil spec. The spec appearing in the amended .doc was obtained directly from the Delo North America website after further searching. Here is a link:

https://www.cbest.chevron.com/msdsServer/controller?module=com.chevron.lubes.msds.bus.BusPDSList&language=EN&country=&region=NA&isLoginPage=true&searchScreen=y

Enter "Supreme"
"English"
"United States"

[Patrick H.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

Okay, you never get to do an endoscopy on me, my friend.

Duke

I think the gov't is doing that to all of us right about now, but that's a whole 'nother topic.

Still don't know how I missed the second page. I looked at a few of them.

Too busy studying for Boards.

Patrick

[Nick M.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

Interesting reply. I ask you a question, you give me a story about fishing but I'm the guy who is ranting. Thanks for all your help

[Duke W.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

You're welcome.

[Joe C.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

Here is a side-by-side compilation of phosphorous and ash content, in per-cent by weight:

BRAND..............Delo 400LE............Delo400LE...........Delo100...... ....Supreme.........Delo400
VISCOSITY.........10W-30................15W-40..............SAE30............various.......... .various
API SERVICE.........CJ-4....................CJ-4.................CF-2................SL...............CF/SL
PHOSPHOROUS....0.11...................0.12........ ........0.098.............0.078............0.116
ASH....................1.00...................1.00 ................ 0.76................0.80.............1.35

[Duke W.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

Duke,

The Spec Sheet attached .doc file has been amended, above, by changing the SM motor oil spec. The spec appearing in the amended .doc was obtained directly from the Delo North America website after further searching. Here is a link:

https://www.cbest.chevron.com/msdsServer/controller?module=com.chevron.lubes.msds.bus.BusPDSList&language=EN&country=&region=NA&isLoginPage=true&searchScreen=y

Enter "Supreme"
"English"
"United States"

There are a dozen specs for "Supreme". All the titles say API SM, and the couple I looked at listed the P concentration as .078% (780 ppm), which is within the SM limit of 800.

I don't know where you got what you put in that Word file (the 5W-20), but whatever.... "Supreme" is Chevron's SI engine oil product line designed for modern SI engines, so I would not use anything in this product line in a vintage engine.

If it doesn't say "Delo"...

Duke

[Duke W.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

Here is a side-by-side compilation of phosphorous content, in per-cent by weight:

BRAND..............Delo 400LE............Delo400LE...........Delo100...... ....Supreme
VISCOSITY.........10W-30................15W-40..............SAE30............various
API SERVICE.........CJ-4....................CJ-4.................CF-2................SL
PHOSPHOROUS....0.11...................0.12........ ........0.098.............0.078

Almost... now add the data for Delo 400 Multigrade, which is primary category CI-4 Plus. If you get one of those hokey "Extreme Energy" cams with gorilla valve springs, that's what you should use. OE valvetrains will be just fine with CJ-4.

Oh, and the Supreme should be rated SM, not SL.

.100% = 1000 ppm [corrected]

Duke

[Patrick H.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

.0100% = 1000 ppm

Duke

???

.100% = 1000 ppm

Watch your decimal points.

[Duke W.]

Re: CJ-4 versus CF-2

Oops!

Duke