GM

[Art A.]

Re: GM

Both Michael and Duke pretty well tell EMD's story. I have tried to forget as much of it as possible, but you are bringing me back a little. I worked extensively on the "H" engine the last couple years there; writing the service manual and maintenance instructions. Not a day went by that I wasn't out in the shop to view different stages of assembly. It was a design that didn't lend itself well to assembly line processes, rather was built something like the new Corvette C-7 engine - a dedicated team/crew on each individual engine. Therein may lie the problem unless they have resolved these issues since I left. I know they thought it crucial to bring the 12 cylinder version to market to address emissions concerns (specially in California).

One reason I have lost touch there is so many of the engineers have been let go by the new owners. I can't imagine how they are able to operate without these key people. The people that they have moved up to replace them are those that I thought would never amount to much as they were the types that always reinvented the wheel instead of checking the archives. They tend to waste a lot of time solving problems that had already been dealt with years ago (we all know the type). They also look to gain recognition by cost cutting in critical areas such as piston rings (big recent problem).

About GM's attention to EMD in years past, the most recognition we could hope for was 3 paragraphs and a photo in the Annual Report. Actually, we liked to think of it as non-interference. Besides, our main competition with GE was with Jack Welsh. We used to tape his picture to the wall and throw darts at it, Ha! He was a shrewd business man.

Regarding the AC locomotives, on paper it may look like GE's individual Inverters would be better, but EMD chose to go with proven European Technology to be first to the market. I also believe we had the better trucks with the articulated axles which performed better in low drag service on irregular track surfaces and curves. Combined with the flange oiling system, we also had addressed a high cost maintenance concern of the railroads - that of wheel wear. That was then, this is now. I imagine they have fallen significantly behind GE in recent years.

Thanks for the memories guys. Off to California tomorrow for a week with old friends - wonder if I should take my walker.

Stu Fox

Stu did you ever work with a Jim Nelson at EMD?

[Stuart F.]

Re: GM

The White House will have a press conference at 11:55 EDT to about 12:15, followed by a GM press conference. Both expected to be carried by most media outlets - this according to GM Retirees News this AM.

Duke;

Sleep well. You won't miss a thing. If Obama is true to form, it won't begin until another hour or so after that, depending on how many Soap Opera's he can pre-empt.

The name Jim Nelson rings a bell, but I can't put a face to it.

Stu Fox

I'll be in the air by 3:25 pm on my way to LGB and LAS so may have to leave for the Airport during the broadcast. Hate to miss it.

[Wayne B.]

Re: GM

Yippeee! I won the wishbone pull on the Sunday chicken so here goes...I wish GM divy's up there divisions and sells off the Corvette division to a group made up of...us! (for a song) or would that be two wishes?

[Jim W.]

Re: GM

That may be the last quoted price on the "old" GM stock you ever see.

Many recent big corporation bankruptcy filings occurred on Sunday. I would make an even odds bet that GM will file this Sunday, so there will be no trading of the stock on Monday, and the shares will likely end up worthless.

Various meetings are scheduled through Saturday, but I doubt if they will result in any revelations.

Corporations are like people. They are born but tenuous, sometimes grow to powerful adults, but always end up in declining old age, and then die. History is full of them.

Look at the steel companies and most of the US railroads from the early days of GM. They were the big players in the Dow Jones Industrial and Transportation (actually back then it was the "Railroad Index") indices for most of the twentieth century, but most of them are now long gone.

Look at the computer industry after it went through its first consolidation stage circa 1990 - like the auto industry in the twenties and thirties. Anyone remember DEC? Compaq? I actually worked for DEC back when they were number two in the industry going after IBM? Who would have ever guessed!

I can now say that three of the four companies I worked for during my proferssional career (not counting the USAF) are out of business, and this includes GM. The only one left of my "old four" is IBM. The other one that went out of business was a small CAD/CAM company that none of you likely ever heard of. Fortunately IBM is the only one where I earned a pension, and it is currently paying.

Sometimes I think we'd all be better off if we were stone age hunter-gatherers. Think of native Americans before the arrival of Europeans. They actually had a pretty good life - as long as they were healthy and Buffalo roamed the plains, they had ultimate freedom!

Duke

I have to agree with most of what you say Duke. Most companies grow with one generation, pass it off to the next in line, but are often sold or merged with another company. However in the Insurance industry, AIG is a company we, ( Taxpayers) have poured about 170 billion if not more just to keep it afloat. But a English insurance company is solvent, vigorously doing business and it's future is secure. I'm refering to Lloyd's of Londons, which has been in business for the last 322 years. So obviously some companies are being run by professionals who are interested in the Companies financial health rather than their own. Mr. Wagoner was paid 16.5 million per year as his salary, plus a once a year bonus of 15 million at the end of the year. So he alone was paid 31.5 million, and I'm sure he has a ton of GM stock (For what's it worth) This is quite the opposite of the CEO of Toyota who's salary is 1 million a year to run the biggest automobile company in the world. So I think honesty is separated by more than just an ocean ! I would like to see the Corvette, and I can get 31 MPG in my 2003 when I'm on the turnpike. But when the corvette is grabbed up by the bean counters, then the Corvette will have a somewhat bleak future ! IMHO

[Clem Z.]

Re: GM

resale rick is still on the payroll at GM till the feds decide if he is entitled to the $20M in his retirement package

[Jim W.]

Re: GM

resale rick is still on the payroll at GM till the feds decide if he is entitled to the $20M in his retirement package

I gotta tell you Clem, as one guy to another, I haven't seen this level of borderline white collor criminal behavior since the famous 'Junk Bonds and Savings and Loan' dilemma of the 80's. I'm not that well learned as to corporate meeting room thievary, but the 'fire sale' that is General Motors today sure doesn't give me any hope for Corporate America from this day going forward. AL Capone once said "You can get a lot further with a kind word and a gun than you can with a kind word alone, but it don't hurt to try the kind word first !"

After buying GM only for the last 35 years , I'm damned to be able to see another five years of patronizing General Motors products. I was looking forward to the Chevy 'Volt' But I have to wonder where this 'Electricity' which we're all going to plug our cars into at night, is going to come from. In the summer, when I turn on the AC, my electric bill hits new highs every year. Now I'm expected to plug in a automobile as well? And with the antiquated electric gird we have in this country I'm dumb founded by the accepted view? Maybe there's something I'm missing here ?

[Henry S.]

Re: GM

One reason I have lost touch there is so many of the engineers have been let go by the new owners. I can't imagine how they are able to operate without these key people. The people that they have moved up to replace them are those that I thought would never amount to much as they were the types that always reinvented the wheel instead of checking the archives. They tend to waste a lot of time solving problems that had already been dealt with years ago (we all know the type). They also look to gain recognition by cost cutting in critical areas such as piston rings (big recent problem).

Stu Fox

The "higher ups" decided they could bring in the new blood for half the price so those with the experience were booted out and those "youngins with fresh ideas" brought in. Unless of course you were on a rung high enough up the ladder you were an "untouchable".

[Stuart F.]

Re: GM

The Volt won't be a "plug in" electric car. Instead, it will use a small gas engine to run a generator which in turn will drive traction motors like a diesel electric locomotive, i.e. electrical transmission.

Stu Fox

[Terry M.]

Re: GM

I have spent 40-years in the electric transmission and distribution business. Don't worry about the electric grid. In most places in the country the increased load of electric cars will not make a difference. Remember that it is unlikely that 100,000 electric cars will magically appear next week, next month or even next year. Some locations will need to reinforce the grid, but they should be doing that anyway.

Be more concerned about how you will recharge the electric car. Not everyone has a garage to pull the car into. How will it be recharged at the curb? In the apartment complex parking lot? Consider the homeowner's association take on THAT! More importantly, how will they work in the cold of the north? Until those kinds of questions can be answered there is no need for concern about the electric utility infrastructure in the near term.

However, in the mean time a wise, well run, utility will be preparing for the possibility of increased load from this. The so-called smart-grid technology will allow consumers more control of their electric use, and time-of-day pricing may drive much of the electric car load to the overnight time when, in most cases, the electric grid is less loaded.

[Jim W.]

Re: GM

Gas is on its way up. Our Comander In Chief has said that we must keep gas at 4 to 5 $ a gallon with tax increases this way the money is not going to the evil oil company's and encourage us into fuel efficient viehicles ( like the 22 person bicycles that you see in Vietnam even a spot for your goat). The electricity that will power all of our new cars just comes out of the wall like magic.

Well I was watching ABC's 20/20 program and they had an interview with the Saudi oil Minister, and he stated that as far as Saudi Arabia needs to make $55.00 a barrel of oil to cover all the costs they spend in the whole oil exploration and drilling process. Now anything above that is pure profit, But he stressed that if you allow the cost to exceed $75.00 a barrel then your looking at losing money because people will be reacting by not using oil products as much as possible, and thats bad. I was surprised by his POV that the price of oil cannot be allowed to wander all around the the cost of a barrel of oil. There must be a stable cost per barrel across the board for all of us to continue using oil products. That was his take on wild the up and downs of oil prices ! I thought it was interesting that super high prices actually hurt oil producing countries and that's bad for everybody. I don't know ?

[Wayne B.]

Re: GM

Well I for one have bought my last U.S. made car. Now, I'd like to support US businesses but the way it is now I'd be buying a car built by companies owned lock stock and barrel by the Unions and the Democratic Party. No Thanks.

[Duke W.]

Re: GM

The Volt won't be a "plug in" electric car. Instead, it will use a small gas engine to run a generator which in turn will drive traction motors like a diesel electric locomotive, i.e. electrical transmission.

Stu Fox

I believe the Volt does have a battery pack with enough energy to travel 20-40 miles on the battery alone, and the batteries will be rechargeable from the electric power grid.

This will cover most typical trips, including at least one way to work for most Americans.

If battery reserve drops below a certain level the IC engine/generator is started and provides the wattage for the traction motors and recharging the batteries.

I think it's a good architecture. There is lots of capacity on the current electrical grid for overnight charging since night time power consumption drops dramatically, even in the heat of summer.

Duke

[Clem Z.]

Re: GM

I have spent 40-years in the electric transmission and distribution business. Don't worry about the electric grid. In most places in the country the increased load of electric cars will not make a difference. Remember that it is unlikely that 100,000 electric cars will magically appear next week, next month or even next year. Some locations will need to reinforce the grid, but they should be doing that anyway.

Be more concerned about how you will recharge the electric car. Not everyone has a garage to pull the car into. How will it be recharged at the curb? In the apartment complex parking lot? Consider the homeowner's association take on THAT! More importantly, how will they work in the cold of the north? Until those kinds of questions can be answered there is no need for concern about the electric utility infrastructure in the near term.

However, in the mean time a wise, well run, utility will be preparing for the possibility of increased load from this. The so-called smart-grid technology will allow consumers more control of their electric use, and time-of-day pricing may drive much of the electric car load to the overnight time when, in most cases, the electric grid is less loaded.

no matter of all this talk about electric cars i bet the gasoline will be powering our cars for the next 10-20 years. it will cost more because we will use less and the govt will figure out a way to get the profit instead of the arabs like a large govt tax on it.

[Henry S.]

Re: GM

Well I for one have bought my last U.S. made car. Now, I'd like to support US businesses but the way it is now I'd be buying a car built by companies owned lock stock and barrel by the Unions and the Democratic Party. No Thanks.

Yeah Wayne, I'd much rather stick the money in the pockets of some fata** CEO that already has more money than he knows what to do with or someone like China or Korea so we can help them become stronger. Or the Saudis if they decide to get into the market. WAIT, aren't we bitchen already about lining the pockets of those oil barons?? I don't believe it is the answer for our government to become the automaker CEO's but I also don't think we completely wipe out the US automakers and buy foreign cars. But if I or ANY of the rest of us knew the right answer we would be alot richer than we are.

[Clem Z.]

Re: GM some good news

Corvette plant will stay open

By MIKE ALEXIEFF, The Daily News, malexieff@bgdailynews.com/783-3235
Monday, June 1, 2009 11:53 AM CDT