Pump & Dump

[Mark F.]

Howdy all.

I have not been on the board since last April, so I don't know if this has already come up as a discussion item. If so, I apologize for the redundency.

There is a black/black 1965 coupe for sale on ebay that is strongly touting its the real deal by virtue of its 1996 chapter meet NCRS top flight award. The seller, "vetmarc" aka Marc Nebenzahl, who is selling the car has posted a picture of the trim tag, but it is an obvious early reproduction. I have notified the guy, even send him photos of real trim tags, but he simply thanks me for my opinions. I suppose buyer beware is in order here since he has posted a pic of the tag, but I wanted to give this fraudster as much attention as I can. This morning his coupe had a bid nearing $64K. Attached is the link to the ebay ad. I feel sorry for the person who is relying on the seller's self-professed knowledge of these cars and ends up with who knows what.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1965-NCRS-TOP-FLIGHT-RARE-BLACK-BLACK-LEATHER-COUPE_W0QQitemZ300371120916QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUS_Cars_Trucks?hash=item45ef839314

[Tom H.]

Re: Pump & Dump

I think a post last week hinted at a car like this, but failed to call out the specific car. I assumed this was the one. Check through last weeks threads. You'll see it.

I'll save you some time. Here it is.

https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthre...74433&uid=4079

[Paul H.]

Re: Pump & Dump

I don't see any attempt to deceive. He did describe everything as "New, NOS or restored." Maybe that includes the trim tag What do you think of the last character on the VIN derivative on the pad stamp (The 0)???

[Gene M.]

Re: Pump & Dump

VIN derivative on the pad stamp (The 0)??? ................... must be "New, NOS or restored."

he seems to have that covered to!

[Michael W.]

Re: Pump & Dump

I know the name 'Nebenzahl' either from here or possibly the CRPL. The seller does make an error by saying that the NCRS has 'certified' the car and does not mention whether it's a Chapter, Regional or National award. There is no picture of the actual certificate (does it really exist?) nor the date of the award. If the bidders are not aware of the particulars of what a Flight award means, and can't be bothered having the car inspected for authenticity and current condition, too bad for them.

Why don't you post your question on the eBay site itself, that way everyone will see it.

[Mark F.]

Re: Pump & Dump

Hi Michael
Only the seller can post questions and in this case he chooses to omit my question about the authenticity of his trim tag, but has included questions that promote the car. He posted the questions that promote his car AFTER I sent him my question on his trim tag. The seller has all the information now to do the right thing, yet he refuses. As I stated in my initial post, the seller told me that the NCRS Top Flight award was from a 1996 Chapter event in Florida.

I know the name 'Nebenzahl' either from here or possibly the CRPL. The seller does make an error by saying that the NCRS has 'certified' the car and does not mention whether it's a Chapter, Regional or National award. There is no picture of the actual certificate (does it really exist?) nor the date of the award. If the bidders are not aware of the particulars of what a Flight award means, and can't be bothered having the car inspected for authenticity and current condition, too bad for them.

Why don't you post your question on the eBay site itself, that way everyone will see it.

[Michael W.]

Re: Pump & Dump

As I stated in my initial post, the seller told me that the NCRS Top Flight award was from a 1996 Chapter event in Florida.

Ooops, you're right. Maybe not posting a picture of a 13 year old chapter award was not an oversight.

[Jim V.]

Re: Pump & Dump

I viewed that car back in 2005-6 at the Kissimmee regional. Guy wanted $40, I took a pass. Looks like kick the can to me. Blows my mind that current seller even posted the tags on-line! Suppose he didnt know either? Where is the NCRS judging assurance or validation department....hmmmm

[Mark F.]

Re: Pump & Dump

Hi Jim
Nice to hear from you. I think he posted the trim tag photo to absolved himself of future liability. He pumps the heck out of the car in his ad and then displays the obvious bogus trim tag. This way he will be able to say that an informed buyer should have known. Most all of us think he should take this a step further and not mis-represent a car. Judging by the current $$ bid level and by the nature of the questions he has posted, it sounds like he has friends helping him with this transaction. The most recent question, which I have copied from his ebay listing and pasted below, is the silliest statement I have ever read. That question alone should cause a real prospective buyer to think twice about the ligitimacy of this car and the reputation of the seller.
From vetmarc's ebay listing the latest posted question.....

<< "I have been looking for a while for that special 65 to put into my garage and came across yours. I am very impressed with it and would like to call you to discuss it. I am an NCRS member and looking for an NCRS TOP FLIGHT car. Knowing that it is and knowing that my fellow members inspected the car and gave it their approval as a TOP FLIGHT, I fee completely safe in buying one on ebay. Are you available this evening around 7pm pst? please advise and thanks. JT"

I viewed that car back in 2005-6 at the Kissimmee regional. Guy wanted $40, I took a pass. Looks like kick the can to me. Blows my mind that current seller even posted the tags on-line! Suppose he didnt know either? Where is the NCRS judging assurance or validation department....hmmmm

[Patrick T.]

Re: Pump &amp; Dump

I knew I had seen that name here.

https://www.ncrs.org/forum/archive8.cgi/noframes/read/35420

[Andrew S.]

Re: Pump &amp; Dump

I'm planning on buying the TT book, but what are the biggest reasons this tag (or a tag generally) is obviously a reproduction?

(I had an NCRS judge inspect mine)

[Jim V.]

Re: Pump &amp; Dump

"approval as a TOP FLIGHT, I fee completely safe in buying one on ebay." arghhhhhhhh......

Can somebody at least verify the TF via vin????

[Michael W.]

Re: Pump &amp; Dump

Can somebody at least verify the TF via vin????

Got $300 handy?

[Roy S.]

Re: Pump &amp; Dump

Gentlemen, this vehicle has what in the hobby was known by those in the know at the time as the "ET" tag, it was the first reproduction trim tag I ever saw on a judging field. These tags originally showed up in the 1991-1992 time frame. This vehicle was judged before NCRS judges as a group were astute enough to catch the reproduction trim tags, well before the NCRS Authentication Library Volume One GM issued 1963-1967 Corvette Trim TagsThe current owner was not the owner when it was judged, was probably not the counterfeiter, and may not have known when he posted the eBay ad, although I imagine he is starting to suspect there may be a problem.

[Bob H.]

Re: Pump &amp; Dump

Here was my statement to him and his response:

This is a very nice looking car. I don't know if you are aware but the trim tag is VERY suspect as is the block VIN. I have bought and sold several Vettes on EBAY as recently as 2 weeks ago and would hate to see someone misled including you if you are unaware of this

AS FAR AS I AM CONCERNED , EVERYTHING IS THERE....I EVEN
SPOKE TO THE GUY TODAY WHO OWNED THIS CAR, RESTORED IT
AND TOP FLIGHTED IT BACK IN 1996. HE OWNED THE CAR FOR 12
YEARS AND JUST DISCOVERED IT TODAY ON EBAY.

If he wasn't aware before, he certainly knows now. Hopefully, the bidding is from his buddies, not some unknowing guy. Just another good reason to be invloved in NCRS.