C2 - What would it be work?

[Donald H.]

I would like to purchase a C2 Coupe. My preference is a 67 L79 Silver with black interior. What I have found is out of my price range so far.

However, I have found a nice driver quality 66 L79.

The good - partial frame on restoration was done, the engine and drive line have all be rebuilt or refreshed.

The interior is decent, the gauge cluster has been restored.

Per the trim tag, the interior should be blue, but has been changed to black. I prefer the black and would prefer to have it repainted Silver. So both the interior and exterior would not match the trim tag.

If I buy this for $35k and put another $15k - $20k into it, i.e. have $50 - $55k invested and with the wrong colors, will I be underwater as far a value? In other words, how much does the wrong colors affect the overall value of the car?

I not buying to finish and sell, but will keep the car, so that isn't the issue. I just don't want to be over invested in a C2 like I am now with the C1 I am restoring.

Thanks,

Don

[Tom H.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

Don, this is just my opinion. You will probably get others, but I think if you have 55K to invest, you can find a nice, original configuration 66 350HP coupe that needs nothing.

[Peter V.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

Don,

What Tom said!

[Dennis S.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

If I had to guess, the wrong color affects the overall value of any car to the extent of what it would cost to professionally remove the incorrect paint and then paint the car in the correct color.

Due to the overall economy and current market conditions, we are all probably over-invested in these cars. Join the party. Creation cost does not equal value, and has not for quite some time now.

[Donald H.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

Don, this is just my opinion. You will probably get others, but I think if you have 55K to invest, you can find a nice, original configuration 66 350HP coupe that needs nothing.

I thought so to, but I've been looking for six month, Driveline, Craigslist, EBay, all the zillions of web site and not found what I am looking for. I am retired and have enjoyed doing the restoration work on my 60. I've done most of the work so far myself and am kind of looking for my next project, but I don't want to do another total frame off.

I looked the 66 over for about three hours, and while I am no C2 expert, I was able to check out the birdcage very good, the frame kickup area, and the body panels and bonding strips.

A big part of my issue is that I bought the 1960 off EBay without looking at it. I believed what the previous owner told me over the phone. That was my first corvette purchase and now that I am wiser I paid $10 to $15 more than the car was worth given it's actual condition. So at this point I'm not a very trusting buyer.

My though was that if I can get a decent 66 or 67 and do the cosmetic and minor mechanical work myself then I would know what I had when I was done.

[Donald H.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

If I had to guess, the wrong color affects the overall value of any car to the extent of what it would cost to professionally remove the incorrect paint and then paint the car in the correct color.

Due to the overall economy and current market conditions, we are all probably over-invested in these cars. Join the party. Creation cost does not equal value, and has not for quite some time now.

I have learned that lesson all to well given what I have spent on my 60 restoration and what I have estimated to spend to finish. I just told my wife that I could have bought a new Z06 and saved some money

[Tom H.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

Don. It's all about what you want. Having too much money in a nice car isn't all that bad. Having a good solid car that you feel confident to drive is worth a ton in itself. If you like it, buy it and enjoy it.

[Jim C.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

I'm with Tom on this one. However, if you are dead set on a specific color and interior, then maybe you found the right car for YOU!!! Remember, you're the guy who's paying for it and hopfully enjoying it. I like them to be as original as possible, including the color and interior. When I bought my first and second 1966s, I went strictly for originality, including the paint color and interior. I was lucky to find a Milano Maroon / black interior car the first time around. I really liked the maroon. My current car is Laguna Blue / dark blue interior. I was not a huge fan of blue, but the color has grown on me, and now I like it more than the maroon color. Originality is important to me, but that's me, even if the color wasn't my first choice. You wouldn't be the first guy to repaint a car a different color, however, for $55k, I also believe that there's a nice driver out there that will need nothing. You might have to compromise on the color.

Jim C.

[Donald H.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

I'm with Tom on this one. However, if you are dead set on a specific color and interior, then maybe you found the right car for YOU!!! Remember, you're the guy who's paying for it and hopfully enjoying it. I like them to be as original as possible, including the color and interior. When I bought my first and second 1966s, I went strictly for originality, including the paint color and interior. I was lucky to find a Milano Maroon / black interior car the first time around. I really liked the maroon. My current car is Laguna Blue / dark blue interior. I was not a huge fan of blue, but the color has grown on me, and now I like it more than the maroon color. Originality is important to me, but that's me, even if the color wasn't my first choice. You wouldn't be the first guy to repaint a car a different color, however, for $55k, I also believe that there's a nice driver out there that will need nothing. You might have to compromise on the color.
Jim C.

I also like the car to "appear as original". That is why I am doing my 1960 restoration to NCRS standards. I am somewhat confused when folks use the term original. Do you and others mean the appearance of originality and not necessarily with all original parts, paint, etc?

There can't be very many of these 45 - 50 year old cars that are original, i.e. original interior and original paint. In fact, I'm not sure I would want one. I'm very particular how it looks. I'm not after a car that has faded and worn carpets, splits in seats and stress and spider cracks in the paint just for the sake of originality. On my 1960 I have replaced just about every nut and bolt on the chassis. The old ones I took of where rusty and really unsafe to reuse. It hard to find usable NOS or good used parts like nuts, bolts, bushings, etc. Not sure I would want to use 50 year old bushing anyway even if they are NOS. So for my 1960 I'm going for the appearance of originaly but I can't make it original as it was not when I got it.

[Tom H.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

That's why you kind of have to do your own thing in this hobby. I love all Corvettes, but there are many of us who absolutely love the "original" stuff with the cracks and all. Then there are some of us that like the shiny better than new look.

My point is, it's a hobby. Forget the money. Do it your way. Post a picture when it's done !!!

[Matt L.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

hi don,
this is just my young opinion. i love these corvettes. i always loved the c2 car. when i found mine it was far from perfect but original. after restoring the engine back to original, and finding the correct parts and more to go, i have more in the car then it's worth. my favorite joke on myself is that i hope the value of the car will someday catch up to the checks i've written to get this far. but the joy i get when i drive my car and the joy it brings people to sit and talk about the good ole days is worth every penny. plus my youngest daughter who's 9 loves cruising in daddy's vette.
life is short. i have found this out on too many occasions. so buy and drive the car that you heart desires and love the hell out of it. enjoy it now cause someday you'll wish you would have.
take care,
matt

[Russ S.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

I have learned that lesson all to well given what I have spent on my 60 restoration and what I have estimated to spend to finish. I just told my wife that I could have bought a new Z06 and saved some money

Or you could have lost as much or more in investments such as stocks!!

[Donald H.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

hi don,
this is just my young opinion. i love these corvettes. i always loved the c2 car. when i found mine it was far from perfect but original. after restoring the engine back to original, and finding the correct parts and more to go, i have more in the car then it's worth. my favorite joke on myself is that i hope the value of the car will someday catch up to the checks i've written to get this far. but the joy i get when i drive my car and the joy it brings people to sit and talk about the good ole days is worth every penny. plus my youngest daughter who's 9 loves cruising in daddy's vette.
life is short. i have found this out on too many occasions. so buy and drive the car that you heart desires and love the hell out of it. enjoy it now cause someday you'll wish you would have.
take care,
matt

OK, so how can you restore an engine back to original. That is what confuses me about the corvette restoration hobby/addiction. I to am rebuilding my original numbers matching 270HP 283 for my 1960. But it was necessary to bore the cylinders. So now will it still be original? I have the original major components, frame, engine, body. My car had a 1963 T-10D transmission. I have replaced with a correct T-10-1B. My car originally had a posi rear, but that had been changed sometime in the past. I found a correct posi carrier and rebuilt the rear. So it is correct for the car, but not the original.

I repeat my prior comment, how do most folks define originality? There are lots of parts that I simply have not been able to find that are correct original GM parts for my 1960. A good example is carpet, seat covers, dash pad, convertible top. Many more. Since may GM originally produced parts are no longer available, I am using a lot of reproduction, but trying to be as correct as possible. So as I stated earlier, I am restoring my 1960 as close to original appearance as possible, but can't every get it to completely original

[Jim C.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

I also like the car to "appear as original". That is why I am doing my 1960 restoration to NCRS standards. I am somewhat confused when folks use the term original. Do you and others mean the appearance of originality and not necessarily with all original parts, paint, etc?

There can't be very many of these 45 - 50 year old cars that are original, i.e. original interior and original paint. In fact, I'm not sure I would want one. I'm very particular how it looks. I'm not after a car that has faded and worn carpets, splits in seats and stress and spider cracks in the paint just for the sake of originality. On my 1960 I have replaced just about every nut and bolt on the chassis. The old ones I took of where rusty and really unsafe to reuse. It hard to find usable NOS or good used parts like nuts, bolts, bushings, etc. Not sure I would want to use 50 year old bushing anyway even if they are NOS. So for my 1960 I'm going for the appearance of originaly but I can't make it original as it was not when I got it.

Original to me means just that..... Original. The original drivetrain and associated components, paint, interior, etc., OR AS CLOSE AS YOU CAN GET IT. When I bought my current Corvette, the water pump and starter were service replacements. I took them off and replaced them with REAL, appropriately dated, correct part number, rebuilt ORIGINAL GM parts. My dash and gauges are totally unrestored and original, and so is my rear carpet and storage area. Unfortunately, my seats, front carpet and interior door panels were replaced in the early 1980s. And unbelievably, I strongly suspect that my paint is also the original factory lacquer.

Hey, it's your car!!! Make it the way you want it. You simply asked for our opinions. We gave them. I like original right down to the nuts and bolts if it's possible. We all probably over spend to get our cars the way we want them. I say go for it. Make the car the way you want it. In my opinion, $50k might be better spent on a "closer to original" car versus paying to make it less original. But that's still your call.

Jim C.

[Ronald L.]

Re: C2 - What would it be work?

Don,
The motor is one of the hot buttons, if you have to rebore it - you can't see if from the outside, it looks original. A good restorer is going to have all that kind of work documented as a part of the cars' history versus those that hide the restamped motor passing down the line and eventually it becomes original again. You know what they say, its original only once. If you fit to the NCRS definition of restoration you are going to be very close, but not enough for Bloomington in certain cases.

Bottom line is you should have proper fasteners and proper finishes on all the parts - that comes from tons of hours invested in studying AIMS, GM parts books, this forum, and most importantly go see known un touched original cars when they show up. With all that as a bill of material you can put one of these back to factory appearance.

My opinion is you are going to pay a premium for a 67 because its a 67 and you can still find decent driving originals that are not completely destroyed inside or out, you were probably looking at 67's when a red 66 327 one owner sold a while back for about 33k.

To be sure on safety you should go through the suspension rubber and brakes, the driveline will let you know if it needs work, engines, clutches, etc all tell you when they need attention.

You need to look at this as GM had cars designed back then that needed tons of work at 50,000 miles, alternators, starters, shocks, brakes, tires, etc. So parts are going to have to be replaced and its what you replace them with, restored original, NOS, or repop heaven.

My advice on body color is different perhaps than others, around most NCRS shows a wrong color car is like they will treat you like you raped the car - been there done that, but the REAL key is to see how many times the car has been stripped, hit, repainted and repainted without being stripped. You have to look real close at claims of never been hit or never been repainted, but if you find a documented original paint or one repaint car, the body will have seen less machines grinding out all the body lines and curve detail that one that has been the subject of 3 or 4 repaints. Yes, those lines can be fixed, for a lot of money.

Advice on cars on the flee, those that are sold by car flippers are going to have paint dustings and other fast and cheap ways to make the car look better (than they really are) to sell it fast. You have to find the private sellers.

Tom hit the nail pretty straight - you'll be upside down, and I don't expect the market to be strong anytime soon, if ever again, so you have to make this as it is, a hobby and get the car you want or can make.