I'd appreciate your advice. I acquired a '66 roadster roller project (no motor, trans, interior but otherwise intact w/hardtop - late July '66 car). I have an original '66 L79 coupe coupe and am fairly acknowledgable about C2s thanks to NCRS and my reseach library. I plan to complete the '66 roller to strong driver standards using leftover '66 OEM used parts. It's NOM, so I have some leeway since it will never be a Top Flight car, but I still want to do what's right for the car. My questions are: (1) It was alleged to be an original BBC car, but the frame has been redone. I have no original paperwork and no way of knowing if any of the supplied parts, including gauges, are original to this car. The NCRS archives seem to suggest that the major telltales are on the frame and in the gauge details which are suspect here. Is there any way in my situation to verify the BBC claim?; (2) Assuming I can verify the BBC claim, I assume the best thing to do is find a date-correct rebuildable 942 block and go that route, correct?; (3) Assuming I cannot verify the BBC claim, do I use the freshly rebuilt correct but not numbers matching L79 327 (VIN pad is early April '66 Corvette build) in my garage w/a 'rebuilt '66 Muncie I have laying around or do I build up a '72 Corvette 454 bare block in the garage from another project to 427-496ci? Obviously, there's a big cost and horsepower difference in these options. Disregard this. What makes the most sense?
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
James,
Its not clear what you mean by the frame being redone. If it was original to the car it should have some remains of the VIN stamped into it. What it does sound like is that the frame is off the car, so that can be strike one, in that if it was a BB car, the fuel line is one of the harder items to change.
Rear sta bar attachments are another. Gauges are dated, is the date on the back of the cluster one to three weeks from the build date of the car?
The you have to look at 390 425 the cluster has that clue too, is the two digit label in line with same?
I think that you could conceivably get top flight on a pure restoration but you'll need to data mine the pieces you have and prior owners to be sure on some of the details. There's lots on the forum as well on how to tell if a car is an original BB car. Especially if you can't get someone that is close by and knows what to look for to do that investigation for you.
Pictures and lots of them are worth 1000 words each. -
Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
James,
IMO given that you do not intend to flight judge the car and drive it the 327 is the way to go. With the correct choice of cam, carb, ignition and a 5 speed you can easily see 20-22 mpg on the highway. You would have a hard time ever doing that with any big block. The 327 will be less $$$'s to build, maintain, keep cool and much more forgiving under all driving conditions.
But it is your ride so you should build it for yourself
CarlComment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
Ron, the body is on frame and vin markings/plate match but many of car parts were delivered in boxes so may be correct but not necessarily originated on this car. VIN won't id motor though. Frame was wire wheeled and repainted w/Por15 and restored to BBC specs. Checking for original stab bars welds could provide a clue as to BBC. Anything else on frame that can tell me?
Carl, thanks. '66 coupe is a built L79 327 w/Tremec 5-speed. Incredible car. Nice to see what BBC is like.Comment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
Which side is the hood support on? Drivers or pass? Did a big block hood come with the car?
Big block differential with caps or small block with "U" bolts?
Emblem holes in front fender for BB or SB?
Steel oil pressure line or copper plated steel?
BB core support?Comment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
If it turns out it was a BB after verifying different features, conversion to a SB would be different............Comment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
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Hood support on driver's side but has a replacement one piece front end
Have not checked diff but will, thanks. Owner may have added/changed.
Emblem holes drilled on replacement nose for BB; not definitive.
BB core support - BB core support but could be swapped in.
Tach has correct BB 390 redline but could be from other car.
Was frame or anything on frame specifically manufactured or welded by factory for SB not BB (or vice versa) that I could check for post-production mods/welds? Any clues in VIN, data plate, production date or otherwise?Comment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
Carl,James,
IMO given that you do not intend to flight judge the car and drive it the 327 is the way to go. With the correct choice of cam, carb, ignition and a 5 speed you can easily see 20-22 mpg on the highway. You would have a hard time ever doing that with any big block. The 327 will be less $$$'s to build, maintain, keep cool and much more forgiving under all driving conditions.
But it is your ride so you should build it for yourself
Carl
My head and my wallet tell me you are right 100%. Easily a $10K minimum further investment if I go BB. But if I can confirm it's original BB and go SB, I've ruined it IMHO. If it is impossible to determine, I will likely go SB with a clear conscience. Would an experienced NCRS judge/member be able to tell from inspection in its current condition if original BB or SB based on logic or intuition?Comment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
James,
Most of the items that can indicate a car was originally a big block are in the front end and since the entire nose on your car has been replaced, it may be very difficult to come to any conclusion on it's originality.
Items that are easily added or bolted in place are not good clues, especially if they have been added recently. These items would include the rear stabilizer bar and radiator core support etc etc.
There is one item that may be helpful thought and that would be a battery cable clip that is riveted to the firewall that was only used for big block. There was a good discussion on this right here about a week ago. The discussion described the location of the clip. If you can't find it, I'll dig it out later for you.
You mentioned that the instrument cluster included a correct tachometer for big block. That would be a tach with a low range red line. (I don't remember the RPM range) The tachometer used for a 390 HP 427 would have been the same as a 300 HP.Comment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
Mike, thanks for the info on the battery clip. I'll research the tech discussions and find it. You're absolutely right about the frustrating fact about there being a dual SB and BB application for the tach redlined so no cigar there. Thanks for your and everyone's help.Comment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
James, I think that the u-joints and u-bolts were different on BB propeller shafts, but I'm not very knowledgeable on BBs. Maybe someone could comment on this. There would be no reason to change this on an SB conversion and they should still be there.
PaulComment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
There is another very subtle tell tale I have seen on 67 and 70 cars that I believe would also apply to 66 BBs. The rear spindles were apparently a different alloy or heat treatment, and there is a dimple or "X" mark on the raw forged part of the spindle that is visible through the center hole of the wheel. (Compare with small block cars.) I have always considered LT-1s to be big block cars with a small block engine, and they also have this feature. The 1970 Corvette catalog descibes big block and LT-1 cars as having "heavier duty rear wheel spindle support arms". I have not noticed a difference in the support arms (maybe the catalog writer confused spindles and spidle support arms), but the heavy duty parts were apparently included in a trailing arm assembly common to big blocks and LT-1s since the LT-1s (unlike other SBs) also had trailing arms drilled for rear sway bars (which never came on LT-1s). If someone has literature relating to the introduction of 1965 big blocks there may be a reference to heavy duty trailing arm parts.Comment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
At least on midyears, there was only one pair of rear trailing arm assemblies (trailing arm, spindle support, spindle, bearings, splash shield, caliper bracket, rotor, and caliper) that was used on all units; the holes for attachment of the rear stabilizer bar mounting on big-blocks were drilled in an off-line bench fixture at St. Louis. Don't know about C3's.Comment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
James,
Here's the link to the "battery cable clip for big block" discussion from a few weeks ago.
https://www.forums.ncrs.org/showthre...88088&uid=5531Comment
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Re: Advice re '66 C2 roadster project
The 66 BB has a 5500 red line and if I remember correctly the cluster label is different from the 425 HP due to that one having a 6500 red line and then there is that topic of oil gauge pressures, if the BB was different than the SB'ss.
James, what is the 2-digit cluster code and what is the date that is inked on the back?Comment
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