Tonawanda Engine Block

[Ralph S.]

I have a 1964 Numbers Matching Coupe with a Tonawanda Engine Block, rather than a Flint Block. Engine is 365 HP with Factory Air.

Is there any documentation on why the Tonawanda Blocks were used, Documentation of a car with a Tonawanda Block, and any other information?

Looking toward Regional Judging and the Judging Guide requires additional documentation for a Tonawanda Block.

Thanks

[Joe L.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

I have a 1964 Numbers Matching Coupe with a Tonawanda Engine Block, rather than a Flint Block. Engine is 365 HP with Factory Air.

Is there any documentation on why the Tonawanda Blocks were used, Documentation of a car with a Tonawanda Block, and any other information?

Looking toward Regional Judging and the Judging Guide requires additional documentation for a Tonawanda Block.

Thanks

Ralph------

I believe some 1965 Corvettes were originally equipped with small blocks CAST at the Tonawanda foundry. I have not heard of this applying to 1964's but I suppose it's possible that late 1964's were similarly equipped. However, while the blocks were CAST at Tonawanda, they were machined and assembled at Flint. Does your engine have a Flint engine pad stamp?

[Bob H.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

were the blocks mixed during production? My 64 365 air coupe was built on the last day of 64 production and had a Flint block

[Ralph S.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

My car has a Flint engine stamp pad, with a Tonawanda casting number of 3858180. The judging guide states "A very limited number of blocks with casting number of 3858180 wer cast in Tonawanda, N.Y. and were used in very limited quantities in 1964." "This use of this block is typically limited to late production 1964s (mine is May 64). The owner must provide documentation, available for viewing on the judging field, to substantiate the factory installation of this block."

[Dennis O.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

I have no dog in this fight, but I am curious as to what documentation the owner could provide that would "substantiate the factory installation of this block".

[Joe L.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

My car has a Flint engine stamp pad, with a Tonawanda casting number of 3858180. The judging guide states "A very limited number of blocks with casting number of 3858180 wer cast in Tonawanda, N.Y. and were used in very limited quantities in 1964." "This use of this block is typically limited to late production 1964s (mine is May 64). The owner must provide documentation, available for viewing on the judging field, to substantiate the factory installation of this block."

Ralph-----

I don't understand how anyone could produce "documentation" for this sort of thing. To me, it would come down to whether the engine stamp pad is judged as being legitimate. If it is so-judged, then the block must be legitimate, too, regardless of foundry source.

[Michael J.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

I have no dog in this fight, but I am curious as to what documentation the owner could provide that would "substantiate the factory installation of this block".

+1, I agree. Maybe this is a misprint? It sounds impossible to accomplish.

[Michael W.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

Sounds like the OP's car already fits the 'late '64 production' criteria, so why not accept it for judging as presented?

Maybe the sentence "The owner must provide documentation, available for viewing on the judging field, to substantiate the factory installation of this block." could be amended to read "The owner must provide documentation, available for viewing on the judging field, to substantiate the factory installation of this block outside of the aforementioned time frame."

[James G.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

I know of 1965 Fuel Injection cars with the 3858180 block, but this is the first I have heard of a 1964 example. I would ask AL GRENNING and ROY SINOR for a read out on this question.

[Pancho T.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

May '64 is not that late in the production. This would lead me to believe if it was in use in May of that year that there would be several other examples out there with two+ plus months of the production left.Any more out there?

[Terry M.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

I have a 1964 Numbers Matching Coupe with a Tonawanda Engine Block, rather than a Flint Block. Engine is 365 HP with Factory Air.

Is there any documentation on why the Tonawanda Blocks were used, Documentation of a car with a Tonawanda Block, and any other information?

Looking toward Regional Judging and the Judging Guide requires additional documentation for a Tonawanda Block.

Thanks

We see this on occasion in 1969 to 1972 Corvettes, and I recall one case in 1973 to 1977. It does not surprise me that there are other cases. The folks at Flint Engine told me that "from time to time a batch of Tonawanda cast cylinder cases" would be sent to Flint for machining and assembly. The purpose was to ensure that the Tonawanda cast cylinder cases would fit the tooling and machines at Flint so that an alternate casting site was available should Saginaw Metal Casting be unable to supply raw cylinder cases or could not meet sufficient demand for cylinder cases to Flint Engine.

[Wayne W.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

I have seen some 64s too.

[Patrick H.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

We see this on occasion in 1969 to 1972 Corvettes

I see it quite frequently... like whenever I look at my car.

[David L.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

The 1964's were made from August 1963 to July 1964.

May, June, and July are the last 3 months of production, the last 25% of production. I would consider May 1964 as "late" production.
May 1964 is not "early production and it's not "mid" production, so therefore, it's "late" production. "Very late" production would be July 1964.

Ralph,

What is the casting date of your "180" block as compared to the stamped date on the front pad.

Dave

[Ralph S.]

Re: Tonawanda Engine Block

Although the NCRS Judging Manual states: “The casting date is located on the right side of the bell housing”, The Tonawanda Casting date is located on the left hand side of the bell housing. My casting date is January 1964 (can’t view the exact day due to it being blocked by the RF Shield). Also, this is a very rare car with 365HP and Factory Air. Based upon Noland Adams data, only 243 of these cars were produced.