Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - ridiculous or okay?

[Gary K.]

Tore down my '73 CE-block 454 and everything looks impeccable. Took all the measurements with dial indicator (rod side clearance, crank end play, etc) are all close to min. factory specs better than expected. If I had known / seen all this I would not have torn it down. I 100% know this is the one and only rebuild.

Now - is it totally rediculous to re-use main, rod bearings and piston rings if everything looks good. No copper showing on bearings, rings/pistons look clean no gum varnish or carbon. I am getting the block to machine shop to clean magnaflux & check bores, deck etc. Usually I would think "as long as its torn apart replace everything" but I also read some Chevy forums where a good point is made: bearings if placed in exact same journal are worn-in to the crank/rod diameters, parts in A+ condition can/should be re-used.

Any opinions? I'm 80% leaning towards new bearings & rings but would like NCRS input. This is a high-output 4-bolt main 454ci motor that's going to get the CS165 original 427 spec mechanical cam / solid lifters so high HP & compression. THanks!!

[Rob M.]

Re: Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - rediculous or okay?

Tore down my '73 CE-block 454 and everything looks impeccable. Took all the measurements with dial indicator (rod side clearance, crank end play, etc) are all close to min. factory specs better than expected. If I had known / seen all this I would not have torn it down. I 100% know this is the one and only rebuild.

Now - is it totally rediculous to re-use main, rod bearings and piston rings if everything looks good. No copper showing on bearings, rings/pistons look clean no gum varnish or carbon. I am getting the block to machine shop to clean magnaflux & check bores, deck etc. Usually I would think "as long as its torn apart replace everything" but I also read some Chevy forums where a good point is made: bearings if placed in exact same journal are worn-in to the crank/rod diameters, parts in A+ condition can/should be re-used.

Any opinions? I'm 80% leaning towards new bearings & rings but would like NCRS input. This is a high-output 4-bolt main 454ci motor that's going to get the CS165 original 427 spec mechanical cam / solid lifters so high HP & compression. THanks!!

how many miles are on the engine?

[Joe L.]

Re: Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - rediculous or okay?

Tore down my '73 CE-block 454 and everything looks impeccable. Took all the measurements with dial indicator (rod side clearance, crank end play, etc) are all close to min. factory specs better than expected. If I had known / seen all this I would not have torn it down. I 100% know this is the one and only rebuild.

Now - is it totally rediculous to re-use main, rod bearings and piston rings if everything looks good. No copper showing on bearings, rings/pistons look clean no gum varnish or carbon. I am getting the block to machine shop to clean magnaflux & check bores, deck etc. Usually I would think "as long as its torn apart replace everything" but I also read some Chevy forums where a good point is made: bearings if placed in exact same journal are worn-in to the crank/rod diameters, parts in A+ condition can/should be re-used.

Any opinions? I'm 80% leaning towards new bearings & rings but would like NCRS input. This is a high-output 4-bolt main 454ci motor that's going to get the CS165 original 427 spec mechanical cam / solid lifters so high HP & compression. THanks!!

Gary-----


If any copper showed on the bearings you'd know, for sure, that they're not original. Original GM main and rod bearings were premium aluminum, not "tri-metal". Premium aluminum bearings are aluminum on a steel shell.

If the bearings are PERFECT and the crank journals are PERFECT, you can re-use the bearings. If any work is done on the bores (e.g. "breaking the glaze" with a hone), I'd install new rings.

[Timothy B.]

Re: Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - rediculous or okay?

Gary,

If it were mine I would clean the block and not touch the crankshaft journals & reuse the bearings. I think at this point it's best to hone the bores and install new moly rings carefully inspect the pistons and piston ring grooves and reuse.

I would not deck anything until it's checked for flatness, manage and maximize the compression ratio and make sure the valve springs and guides are in V/G condition. Also, use the stock oil pump.

[Joe R.]

Re: Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - rediculous or okay?

There is no way that I would not repace the bearings and rings. The cost is minimal for the bearings and rings but the cost of another rebuild will never be forgotten! Rebuild shops will not guarantee their work if used parts are in the block.
And don't forget to replace the cam bearings and freeze plugs.
Are you going to have the big end of the rods done and the rod bolts replaced. Big blocks are bad about bending rods. Have them checked just for insurance.

JR

[Gary K.]

Re: Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - rediculous or okay?

Thanks for replies, mileage I don't know for sure since '74 CE block installed, all I know everything is (was) factory-tight, no damage anywhere, no observable wear even on bearings. I may have the rods & crank inspected I think that's a good idea, but no work, decking, honing anything unless its needed. Luckily I have a good shop that understands old corvettes & vintage bb's. Honestly I'm kicking myself for tearing apart the bottom end - there's nothing like a factory build in my op.

[Carl N.]

Re: Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - rediculous or okay?

Agree with Joe Ray - once you have it down this far replace all the wear parts and carefully inspect everything else. IMO I would replace cam shaft bearings also. If you marked all the lifters and push rods for correct placement and they look ok you could reuse them. Don't forget Oil Seal in timing chain cover - now is a perfect time to replace. You are too far into it to cut corners if you intend to keep it for a few years.

[Ken A.]

Re: Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - rediculous or okay?

Never reuse rings, unless it's a beater. Bearings are OK to reuse, if clearance is within spec, especially if they're Moraine 400's. You will need to cut the cylinder ridge & check bores for roundness. If within spec I would hone with a deck plate & install premium ring sets.

[Gary K.]

Re: Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - rediculous or okay?

I think I'm going to replace all bearings & rings. I wanted to keep the mains w/crank because they wore together but I've been swayed. May get the kit although any suggestions about the head gasket thickness / compression issue would be appreciated I got +/-.02 average deck-to-piston clearance but some are around .017.

Question: what's best source for the OEM style high-quality bearings mentioned before or the kit itself. Napa? SealedPwr? Federal? Does GM actually still manufacture exact same bearings>

[Joe R.]

Re: Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - rediculous or okay?

Gary,

Here's an article on managing compression ratio (and picking head gasket thickness), starting on page 5:

http://stlouisncrs.org/news_files/St_LouisNCRS_ChapterNewsletter2ndQuarter2012.pdf

Joe

[Joe L.]

Re: Re-use main, rod bearings, rings - rediculous or okay?

I think I'm going to replace all bearings & rings. I wanted to keep the mains w/crank because they wore together but I've been swayed. May get the kit although any suggestions about the head gasket thickness / compression issue would be appreciated I got +/-.02 average deck-to-piston clearance but some are around .017.

Question: what's best source for the OEM style high-quality bearings mentioned before or the kit itself. Napa? SealedPwr? Federal? Does GM actually still manufacture exact same bearings>

Gary-----

GM no longer manufactures the engine bearings. If you purchase the GM bearings today, they will be as manufactured by Federal Mogul. The Federal Mogul main and rod bearings found in the GM boxes will be the "AP" series bearings. These are premium aluminum, the same type as the old GM 400 and 420. The problem is that if you buy them from GM you have to purchase the individual bearings PER EACH and it gets expensive that way. You can get the same bearings, Federal-Mogul-branded, in the aftermarket as SETS. However, to get the same as GM, you have to make sure you get the "AP" series. These almost always have to be special-ordered.

If you replace cam bearings, use Durabond ONLY. Do not use GM. The Durabond are superior to GM (unless GM has switched to Durabond by now).