Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

[Joe R.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Dan, you are correct about not twisting the wires.

Many of the factory production machines are mechanical (the part that runs the dies anyway). We (Amp) had machines that would pull the wire off large spools, cut it to length, strip one or both ends and apply the terminals at the rate of 3,000 per hour.

The crimp however does not work harden the terminal. The dies are designed to put the correct amount of pressure on the wire, this is called "normal force". When the normal force is correct, the wire will not pull out of the terminal unless there's an extreme pull on the wire. Factory customers check these crimps with a crimp height micrometer and a pull test (with our testers) periodically to ensure quality control. Some of our machines automatically monitor the dies to maintain the correct crimp height.
The dies in these machines are designed for specific terminals and wire sizes. Different crimp styles are used for different materials (brass vs Beryllium copper , etc.).

A good, ratcheting hand crimp tool will crimp the terminal to the correct height and will be worry free.
A cheap tool can crimp too much or too little, too little on a tin plated terminal can lead to "fretting corrosion" where vibration can increase the chance of corrosion between the wire and terminal.

Now, on replacement terminals, the ones you buy at Pep Boys are junk, made in the "cheapo" factories in China. Their quality stinks.

Bottom line, buy good terminals (AMP, Molex, T&B) and buy a good crimper. They will work every bit as good as a soldered joint (and I have nothing against soldering).

BTW, if you want more insurance, use double crimp terminals (all I use on the race cars). These have 2 crimps, 1 for the wire and a second crimp that goes around the insulation to lock the wire to the terminal.

Hi Bill,

Could you please provide a manufacturer and part number for a double crimp terminal? Thanks for all the info!

Joe

[Dan D.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Dan, you are correct about not twisting the wires.

Many of the factory production machines are mechanical (the part that runs the dies anyway). We (Amp) had machines that would pull the wire off large spools, cut it to length, strip one or both ends and apply the terminals at the rate of 3,000 per hour.

The crimp however does not work harden the terminal. The dies are designed to put the correct amount of pressure on the wire, this is called "normal force". When the normal force is correct, the wire will not pull out of the terminal unless there's an extreme pull on the wire. Factory customers check these crimps with a crimp height micrometer and a pull test (with our testers) periodically to ensure quality control. Some of our machines automatically monitor the dies to maintain the correct crimp height.
The dies in these machines are designed for specific terminals and wire sizes. Different crimp styles are used for different materials (brass vs Beryllium copper , etc.).

A good, ratcheting hand crimp tool will crimp the terminal to the correct height and will be worry free.
A cheap tool can crimp too much or too little, too little on a tin plated terminal can lead to "fretting corrosion" where vibration can increase the chance of corrosion between the wire and terminal.

Now, on replacement terminals, the ones you buy at Pep Boys are junk, made in the "cheapo" factories in China. Their quality stinks.

Bottom line, buy good terminals (AMP, Molex, T&B) and buy a good crimper. They will work every bit as good as a soldered joint (and I have nothing against soldering).

BTW, if you want more insurance, use double crimp terminals (all I use on the race cars). These have 2 crimps, 1 for the wire and a second crimp that goes around the insulation to lock the wire to the terminal.

Good reply Bill. Work hardening was only a thought I had as factory terminals are very hard - usually brass. Could be they are half hard brass.

By Pep Boys terminals I assume you are talking about the blue, red, yellow terminals that seem to be standard issue at almost any store these days. They are very soft copper, but the plating (I assume the plating is tin or tin lead) is very good and they solder very easily. This is the only reason I use them. But I would not trust the soft copper with only a crimp, no matter what tool one uses. I just think it would relax in time and with elevated temperature.

I was going to mention the double crimp to provide strain relief. The standard issue terminals of course have no strain relief. The shrink tubing I use provides enough strain relief for me to use them. Most spade terminals are double crimp. It probably would not be feasible for the standard issue terminals to be double crimp. Bubba could not handle this.

BTW, we used plenty of Amp terminals when I was still employed. We used NO blue/red/yellow terminals. We had Amp machines to crimp them. Never had any problems that I am aware of.

-Dan-

[William F.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Are we just talking about ring and spade terminals? What about the "tube" type connectors used to joining 2 pieces of wire? Are the ones from FLAS OK? Do you need a racheting crimper for these?

[Bill H.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Hi Bill,

Could you please provide a manufacturer and part number for a double crimp terminal? Thanks for all the info!

Joe

Joe, the part numbers vary with wire size, insulation type and the size of the stud (for a ring terminal).
My favorite mfg. is AMP - cause they paid me for 20+ years. Also, the highest quality you can get.
My suggestion would to go to a distributor that will sell smaller quantities.
Newark Electronics has been around a very long time.

Double crimp example: http://www.newark.com/te-connectivit...imp/dp/73C2907

They also have the good crimp tools.

Note that AMP is sometimes referred to as TE Connectivity (since TYCO bought AMP years ago).

[Bill H.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Are we just talking about ring and spade terminals? What about the "tube" type connectors used to joining 2 pieces of wire? Are the ones from FLAS OK? Do you need a racheting crimper for these?

William, any terminal should be crimped correctly, doesn't matter if it's a ring, the splice you're talking about or a Weatherpak pin & socket on a C4,5,6,.

You may get away using a cheap tool on a splice, may not. An in-line splice probably could be crimped with the ratchet tool that does the same size ring terminals.

[Bill H.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Good reply Bill. Work hardening was only a thought I had as factory terminals are very hard - usually brass. Could be they are half hard brass.

By Pep Boys terminals I assume you are talking about the blue, red, yellow terminals that seem to be standard issue at almost any store these days. They are very soft copper, but the plating (I assume the plating is tin or tin lead) is very good and they solder very easily. This is the only reason I use them. But I would not trust the soft copper with only a crimp, no matter what tool one uses. I just think it would relax in time and with elevated temperature.

I was going to mention the double crimp to provide strain relief. The standard issue terminals of course have no strain relief. The shrink tubing I use provides enough strain relief for me to use them. Most spade terminals are double crimp. It probably would not be feasible for the standard issue terminals to be double crimp. Bubba could not handle this.

BTW, we used plenty of Amp terminals when I was still employed. We used NO blue/red/yellow terminals. We had Amp machines to crimp them. Never had any problems that I am aware of.

-Dan-

I've never scraped the tin off those cheap terminals (I don't have any in the shop). I'd be surprised if they are copper but anything is possible. What you usually see is that the cheap ones are made from thinner material or really cheap brass.
Brass connectors are tin plated for corrosion resistance, uninsulated, brass connectors can be tin plated to help solder flow.

[Gary J.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

I work at a nuclear plant so all of our crimps are with a ratcheting crimper. We also use heat shrink when required. We use a ton of ring terminals. So invest in a ratchet type crimper, heat gun, and heat shrink. It may save your car.

[Gene M.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Thank you guys post #10 and #11 are very informative. I've been successful over the years using the techniques of each. But solder is my strongest claim to "no problems". I learned early that terminals need to come from a good USA supplier in the business.

[Dan D.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

I've never scraped the tin off those cheap terminals (I don't have any in the shop). I'd be surprised if they are copper but anything is possible. What you usually see is that the cheap ones are made from thinner material or really cheap brass.
Brass connectors are tin plated for corrosion resistance, uninsulated, brass connectors can be tin plated to help solder flow.

Hi Bill, all the cheap blue/red/yellow terminals I have seen are soft copper. I just went to my shop and removed the sleeve from two different terminals. All copper.

What I see as the problems with these terminals is this:

1. The colored sleeves deter from the crimping. You can't see where you are crimping, or inspect the crimp afterward. Additionally the sleeve limits the amount of force the crimping tool applies to the terminal.

2. Personally, I hate the colors. To me, the sleeve can be any color you want - as long as it is BLACK. I automatically cut the sleeve off all of these things and replace them with black shrink.

3. The material is very soft, which I believe will cold flow in time, and is the reason that these things will often fail after they have been in service for awhile.

The good points are:

1. Cheap are readily available.

2. Good tin plating insures good electrical contact to the wire and they solder very well.

This has been an interesting thread and very informative. I think we have all learned some things. I know I have. But we have steered away from the OPs problem. He has not responded to any of the posts, so I am going to try and address his problem directly.

-Dan-

[Dan D.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Just spent a frustrating few hours splicing a wire under the dash. As you know, it is difficult working under there. What made it more difficult and frustrating is that I couldn't get a crimp connector to hold. The wire kept pulling out of the connectors.

Any recommendation for a crimping tool that really crushes the connector?

Hi Chris,

You have not given us much info to help with your problem. Your profile says you have a 62. I know these dashes are hard to work under.

But whether you are trying to replace a ring type terminal or a butt splice, you should be able to at least get a tight connection providing you can get your crimping tool on the terminal.

First, make sure you have the correct terminal for the wire size. I am assuming you are using the terminals with the colored sleeves.

As mentioned, do not twist the wire. Leave the strands straight.

First cut the sleeve off of the terminal. You can get a better crimp this way. Use shrink sleeving if you can get the heat gun in there. Otherwise any kind of sleeving should work. I have used small vacuum hose before.

You can buy a ratcheting tool, but they are expensive if you only anticipate a single use.

Tell us what connector you are using and the wire size.

-Dan-

[Bill H.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

I do solder wires occasionally (with heat shrink of course). I a correct crimp and a correct solder are equal in reliability.
Soldering like crimp requires a good tool. If your soldering gun or iron is old and not generating enough heat, you can end up with a cold solder joint (the solder didn't flow correctly). And a free hanging solder joint can work harden in a vibration application which is why you use heat shrink (which everyone here does). The heat shrink acts as a strain relief. It also keeps oxygen off the soldered joint.

The differences in heat shrink could drive you crazy too. Our Raychem heat shrink catalog was over an inch thick.

I do have a little bit of very high quality heat shrink in the shop. The inside of this heat shrink is coated with a heat activated glue, it will even stay sealed under water.

[Bill H.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Hi Bill, all the cheap blue/red/yellow terminals I have seen are soft copper. I just went to my shop and removed the sleeve from two different terminals. All copper.

What I see as the problems with these terminals is this:

1. The colored sleeves deter from the crimping. You can't see where you are crimping, or inspect the crimp afterward. Additionally the sleeve limits the amount of force the crimping tool applies to the terminal.

2. Personally, I hate the colors. To me, the sleeve can be any color you want - as long as it is BLACK. I automatically cut the sleeve off all of these things and replace them with black shrink.

3. The material is very soft, which I believe will cold flow in time, and is the reason that these things will often fail after they have been in service for awhile.

The good points are:

1. Cheap are readily available.

2. Good tin plating insures good electrical contact to the wire and they solder very well.


-Dan-

Interesting to know about the copper, Dan.

The red/blue/yellow insulation is an industry standard to denote the wire gauge size that the particular terminal will fit.
Depending on the application, I sometimes heat shrink right over the terminal insulation.

[William C.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Just FYI, ALL(99% at least) of the electrical connections in a Corvette were Designed and manufactured by Packard Electric Div of GM, now a part of Delphi. I don't know the current state of their aftermarket business these days, but worth checking out if you need new parts. Many used to be available at Dealerships via the "Standard Parts Catalog"

[Kevin M.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation



Here's a picture of the crimping tool that I bought off eBay, can't remember how much I paid but I'm sure it was under $40. Worked great and got the job done.

[William C.]

Re: Wire Crimping Tool Recommendation

Just so you fellows have some reference as to how the wiring was manufactured originally, small gauge sizes 18-20 gauge were generally crimp only processes that can be accomplished with high quality hand tools such as the one shown, I say a quality hand tool as actually we used a small press, measued in tonnage, not pounds of clamp force. 14 gauge and larger were generally applied in what we called a "crimp and sweat" operation in which the stripped wire end was sent thru a solder bath and then crimped to the terminal, using the aforementioned press, and then heated to reflow the solder that had been previously applied to the wire.. Some parts of the previous discussions are scary to say the least.