Engine #

[Tony Roussos]

Greetings everyone.
Thank you very much for allyour help with my numerous repair/ restoration questions.

Now to yet another question: I was told I could find the numbers for the block on the passengers front side just behind the water pump.
My vin is 194371s117419 It's a 1971 350 4-sp coupe.
The numbers I found are: V0417TJY and 14Z160794

How do I interpret these numbers? It seems like the second set means the block came from a later model GM, but is it even Corvette?

Is there a registry anywhere that can help me learn the history of my original block?

I've noticed there are many vettes in my travels in the last year that have different blocks. What's the deal? Were they all so bad they blew up or is it that folks just can't keep their hands off these things?

Thank you.
Tony

[William C.]

Re: Engine #

TJY code was used on '73-74 Chevy and GMC trucks with 350 engine, and again in '78 for the same applications.

[John H.]

Re: Engine #

It was originally installed in a '74 Chevy pickup built at Fremont, California.

[Tony Roussos]

Re: Engine #

So, you're saying my engine is a truck donor or do you think it's a crate replacement used for trucks/corvettes?

I know corvettes have always used truck blocks, basically a 4-bolt main sb 350.

Tony

[William C.]

Re: Engine #

Truck Donor, due to the vin stamping

[Tony Roussos]

Re: Engine #

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Finally some resolution on that question!

Not a bad motor. It runs 22 mpg hwy. Plenty of accelleration.

Thank you,
Tony

[Tony Roussos]

Re: Engine #

Hi John.

How did you find such detail? Are there any other markings I should look for?

Thank you,
Tony

[Mike Cobine]

Re: Engine #

why do Corvettes have replacement engines?

Two primary reasons - theft and broken.

1. Theft - many were stolen because in the days before everyone rebuilt their small blocks into 383s and such, people hot rodded their cars by installing factory high performance engines, i.e., Corvette engines.

With a Corvette crate engine being several hundred dollars in the '60s and up as time went on, the Midnight Auto Supply had a great market for $150 Corvette engines. And that was nearly all profit when the MAS found donor Corvettes on the street.

A lot of that slowed down when people began rebuilding engines on their own and when the Corvette engines became dogs in the mid '70s. Why steal a 180 hp 350 when any decent shop could produce 350 hp to 400 hp from any small block?

2. Blown up, to quote Bill Murray in "Stripes". Corvettes were the American hot rod. People drove them like they were in a race from each corner. And they blew up. Grandpa in his '63 Chevy may never go over 65 on the highway, but young Billy discovered that the valves would float about 155 mph or whatever in his Corvette. This is why today finding a '62 Bel Air with the original engine is not a big deal compared to a '62 Corvette with an original engine. And I mean a real original, not a restamp or restoration block.

[Tony Roussos]

Re: Engine #

Ahhh. I see your point for the 60's C-2's, but how about the 70's C-3? More than half of the 71-73 owners I've talked to had a replacement and half of them didn't have a clue what happened to the original.

Now the gas shortage happened in what 1972-73? I'm guessing most got ripped out, souped-up, and things got swapped like crazy before that came about. Is that about right??

Tony

[William C.]

Re: Engine #

First arab oil embargo (and subsequent fuel price increases/shortages) was fall of 1973. I know because I had a new '74 Corvette on order, scheduled for March delivery due to high demand, and It was delivered mid December after the bottom dropped out of the market.

[Mike Cobine]

Re: Engine #

A couple of things happened then. From '71 up, the compression was lower. So many rebuilt or they replaced engines because in the '70s, even the late '70s, what important in Corvettes was NOT restoring, but in GOING FAST. NCCC was in its heyday. Autocrossing, high speed events, drag racing, and so on were everywhere. One of the "unofficial" activities at Bloomington was the burn-out contests at Holiday Inn.

So while the "Corvette engine" wasn't as desirable to thieves anymore in the '70s, it also wasn't as desirable to the owners. I remember a '78 black coupe at Bloomington '78 that had a ZL-1 stuffed in. The car had only a few thousand miles on it.

Also, this was the beginning of the turbo era. Turbochargers began to appear to make up for lack of power, and boosted engines break. $1400 got you everything you needed to turbo a '70s 350.

In Jan. '77 I sold a '63 convertible that on the test ride the buyer drove it 135 mph with me in the passenger seat and his son on the pad. That is what sold the car - 135 mph. A friend bought a new '76 L-82 in May '76 and we took it for a ride in July where he cranked it up to 115 where it stopped. He was quite disappointed. His '73 Charger SE with a 318 had gone that fast.

With the gas embargo in '73 and I think in '75, gas jumped from a norm of $.25/gal for Shell regular and $.29/gal for Premium to an outrageous $.55 to $.60/gal in Sept. '75. Those "outrageously high" prices drove many to remove the 454s and 427s from cars and replace them with any small block. Lots of 307 powered cars then. I remember a blue/blue '66 convertible with both tops and a 307 for $2100. A friend was selling a '69 Chevelle SS 396 convertible, marina blue with white interior for $600 in '74. A co-worker was trying to sell his original owner Heavy Chevy with cowl induction and the flipper valve for $400 in '75.

But then you have to remember that in '73 and '74, $4 to $5 an hour was a good working wage. $160 to $200 a week gross, which is about $110 to $140 take-home and $12 a week on gas was a lot.

So 283s, 307s, and such replaced those thirsty 396s, 427s, and 454s. Small blocks were $100 used anywhere and you could save that much on gas. The low compression 350s weren't much better, because they were so down on power, they were inefficient (much like my truck's 454 today).

And that is why you find even '70s Corvettes missing the original engines.

[Dick W.]

Re: Engine #

Those were the days to buy cars. A friend bought a '66 coupe 427-425hp 36 gallon tank, and a brand new set of '67 bolt ons for $1,800 in '74. You could buy 68-69 L/88's for $2,500, but who wanted those gas hogs? :D:D

[Michael H.]

Re: Engine #

In about 1973, I watched two mechanics at Celozzi-Ettleson Chevrolet in the Chicago suburbs, intentionally explode a motor in a new 73 Corvette. It was the sales managers car, Ron Morice. Ron complained the car wasn't quite as fast as his last Corvette demo and wanted a new motor under warranty so one of the mechanics drove the car out behind the building and started the motor. He put a broom handle on the throttle and then went to lunch, thinking that it would be exploded and already cooled off by the time he returned. When everyone returned from lunch, the fire dept was there putting out the fire that erupted when the engine finally let go. The engine ran at valve float RPM for about 20 minutes before it finally went. The hot oil hit the red hot exhaust and caught fire. No serious damage other than paint and wiring harnesses but that gives ya some idea of how important original motors were in those years. They weren't.

[Tony Roussos]

Re: Engine #

It's all starting to come back to me now!

I still think I was born way too late in life. (1961) Thanks for the refresher Mike.

Tony

[Mike Cobine]

Re: Engine #

This is one reason I can never see the logic in the lopsided importance of the original engine in restorations today. In a survivor-type class, yes, but in restoration, no.

Back then, an original engine was important because it meant the car had not been messed with.

Today, a frame-off restored Corvette with the original engine has been messed with about as much as one can mess with a car. Maybe you don't consider yourself Bubba, but essentially you have had a hand in everything such that nothing of the original builder's work exists in that car today.

Today in a survivor-type class, the original engine would truly indicate the unique status of surviving the years and gain a special place.

Most judging that I have seen awards for the skill used to return a car to the original condition.

Having the original engine is not skill, but luck.

Building an engine to look completely original, even with the correct stamped numbers, is skill. Building it to original specifications is skill. making it look exactly how it left the factory is skill.

Having the correctly stamped original already there is luck. Now if you have a tale of tracking it across two states or whatever, then that is skill. But few have to do that.

But if the skill of building a correctly stamped restoration engine is discovered, you are chastised, unlike the skill of building any other part on the car.

Retaining the original block, which you have by luck, is rewarded with more points, unlike retaining other original parts that have aged poorly.

An original engine with a .060 overbore, aftermarket stronger rods, an aftermarker camshaft, and such is not original and not even the original configuration, yet is awarded the maximum points.

An engine that has been stamped to look original, having an original bore size, and maintaining original specifications internally can be a nightmare if detected to not be original, even though it is more true to original configuration.

Yes, there was a good reason for glorifying the original engine in 1978. But with $50,000 rebuilds of every nut, bolt, and part of a Corvette today, that reason is weak in today's hobby.