C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

**Michael J.** · June 22, 2016, 08:30 AM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

Here's the one I have for my '64, no deducts if you refuse to take the caps off for the judge...........

http://www.restorationbattery.com/558dc12-tar.html

**Tim T.** · June 22, 2016, 08:58 AM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

I have the "correct " restoration battery in my 63. At the KC Nationals I got a 7 point deduct. Judge took cap off my battery without asking permission. Stated not typical production. At the Auburn Regional this year also got 7 point deduct. Stated service replacement - no bosses?
Tim

**Michael J.** · June 22, 2016, 09:09 AM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

Battery judging is almost as inconsistent as paint.........

**Bill L.** · June 22, 2016, 10:10 AM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

Originally posted by Michael Johnson (49879)

Battery judging is almost as inconsistent as paint.........

Apparently so ----- !!!!! I had a basic 7 point deduct for a service replacement on my '67 last year--- not a tar top but no real explanation as to "why" it was deemed a replacement.... I have heard a lot of explanations over the years but none that make much sense.....

The rule of thumb has always been "If you can't say why then you can't take the deduction......" i.e. just because it looks new and pretty you can't declare it as a reproduction -----

Thanks!!!
Bill

**Michael J.** · June 22, 2016, 10:22 AM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

This is where the judge really, really needs to read the Standard Deduction sheet. I do before I judge anything. It states quite clearly: "No Originality Deduction for original OR original design reproductions that are indiscernible as installed Delco as described in the appropriate year TIM&JG with, and if applicable, appropriate plant and date stamping for the vehicle. NO NOT REMOVE CAPS FOR INSPECTION." (emphasis is mine). So just because it looks new, you can't deduct unless there is something about the configuration you can specify as NTFP.

**Bill L.** · June 22, 2016, 10:56 AM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

Exactly, ---- I have not had the caps removed (no one ever tried) so I think MOST people are aware of that prohibition.... but there may still be an issue regarding "pretty and new" being equal to a repro.... just have to watch for that ...as per your comment on the standard deduction sheet --- I totally agree and I do that prior to judging as well ----one of the guys in our chapter did a laminated sheet of the deduction standards for batteries, tires glass etc..... very handy!!!

**Michael J.** · June 22, 2016, 11:13 AM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

Yes, they hand out the laminated copies at the judging retreats too, that is great. Last year at the National, I had a judge actually ask me to remove the caps, since he couldn't. I said "no". He asked me if I did, would there be acid/water under them, I said "who knows, but I am not taking them off". There are some judges who think a dirty, worn old battery that is original (at least on the outside) should be worth more than any reproduction, no matter how TFP it is, and for other parts too. That is where following the CDCIF process and standard deductions sheets come in handy, to keep it consistent and objective.

**Rick A.** · June 22, 2016, 12:54 PM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

By correct, it is a TAR top battery? Not the poly-tar battery? If truly tar-top like Michael's link depicts, and you have all the correct date code; etc. not sure how/why any judge thinks 7-point deduction is warranted

**William C.** · June 22, 2016, 01:10 PM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

Without a picture of what your battery looks like, all the posts seem to be uninformed speculation. A picture of the actual item under discussion would likely provide some enlightment...

**Bill L.** · June 22, 2016, 03:53 PM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

Sorry my fault --- I may have gotten us off the original topic....

The question was on Tar top batteries and if there is a raised area between the caps....i.e. is there a raised area as indicated in the photo...

Sorry I kinda got us off the trail there ----- see below...

Attached Files

Screen Shot 2016-06-22 at 4.51.04 PM.jpg (41.8 KB, 1094 views)

**Michael H.** · June 22, 2016, 04:13 PM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

I lost 7 points ( standard deduct 30% ) on my 67 battery because my Restoration battery had a lip/ridge about 1" from the top of the battery all the way around the battery, everything else was correct. Now comes in the interputation of "indiscernible" amongst the judges. 7 points seem like a lot but that's standard deductions................next time it will be a plain Delco then I lose 12 points but I save $200+.

Mike

**William C.** · June 22, 2016, 04:49 PM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

At least on all the Tar top configurations I have in Delco Catalogs from the mid-60's the raised areas should be visible from the top.

**Edward J.** · June 22, 2016, 06:06 PM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

Originally posted by Bill Lucia (8620)

Hi there:

I had the opportunity to attend and judge at the Bend regional earlier this month and I had a great time.... I am from Oregon (Portland) and it was fun to go back for a visit....

My question is this..... on several cars with reproduction tar top batteries a deduction was taken for the lack of raised areas between the caps. I have had several reproduction batteries in my cars over the years and most did well usually taking a minor deduct ---- but I don't recall the raised areas and I don't recall an issue with the lack of them......maybe a bad case of CRS??!!!

Can anyone site the definitive source for the raised areas between the caps? Better yet - a photo would really help.

Regards
Bill

Bill, I was at a chapter meet recently, and a judge(is a team leader) make a note about the this 63 car resto. battery that had the correct raised areas, and I believe it was a no deduct, This was a Restoration battery according to owner. He said you'll have to ask for the raised pads??

**Gary J.** · June 22, 2016, 09:19 PM

Re: C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

Maybe someone has a picture of a Real Tar Top they would like to share. Aren't there some raised pads running horizontal between the positive and negative post?
So if the $300.00 plus Restoration Battery is getting a 7 point deduct, would you not be better off putting in a Delco Service Replacement Battery and taking the 12 point deduct? At least you would have money in your pocket.
You would think that if Restoration Battery would fix the problem, but that is like everything else. Why not make it correct the first time!

C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

C2 Tar Top Battery Configuration Issue

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