1967 Perfect Restoration

[Jim D.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

An irresponsible uninformed comment that is an insult to the integrity of 27 individual judges working that day.

100% correct.

[Mitch S.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

Keith, just to be clearer then, it really sounds like you are insulting the integrity of myself and the other 9 judges that judged both those cars! Nice......you need to find another hobby please.........

[Bill M.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

Keith I looked at your profile! you don't even own a mid year! How can you question the judging standards?
Bill

[Keith B.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

No I’m not questioning anybody nor I won’t find a new hobby. In the last ten years I have been involved with chapter judging I have seen a lot of inconsonantly between judges and events where no one can agree on the exterior paint flow chart, and other areas. So either these cars where in deed perfect or some one or somebody went very lenient on interpretation of the manual. And for this hobbies sake I hope it was a perfect car and I may have a bad vision of what I have seen.

[Keith B.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

Keith I looked at your profile! you don't even own a mid year! How can you question the judging standards?
Bill

is this how NCRS as a group wants to treat new younger members who don’t own a Corvette? Well that’s a open invitation to welcome new people

[Bill M.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

on the other hand the cars today do come out better than the factory ever produced. that should be taken into consideration when judging. I am having a lot of trouble finding original gas and air for my 67 and forget about the freon. As for new members welcome aboard just remember some of the worst people I have ever met are in the corvette business ( not hobby )

[David H.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

... last ten years I have been involved with chapter judging I have seen a lot of inconsonantly between judges and events where no one can agree on the exterior paint flow chart, and other areas. ....

Keith

You’re correct to note inconsistency in chapter level judging - judges/members are learning, are unfamilar with years in question, make mistakes and miss items. Regional and National judging events have progressively more experienced judges - fewer mistakes get made. Team leaders are tasked with putting together best judging team with the pool of available judges.

Never been my experience to see a “Friends with benefits in high places” judge. That attitude would get you tossed off a national judging team in a heartbeat.

Dave

[Keith B.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

Bill to me the problem is the judges who make it their business to be in the Corvette business to sell you the correct stuff before and after judging.

[Michael J.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

I know everyone has different goals, standards, and of course how much they are willing to spend for approaching perfection. IMO, the blue color of that ribbon and the title at the top of the certificate are the same for 100 as for 94.

[Keith B.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

I know everyone has different goals, standards, and of course how much they are willing to spend for approaching perfection. IMO, the blue color of that ribbon and the title at the top of the certificate are the same for 100 as for 94.

That is one of the best way to approach this and a great outlook

[Keith B.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

Keith

You’re correct to note inconsistency in chapter level judging - judges/members are learning, are unfamilar with years in question, make mistakes and miss items. Regional and National judging events have progressively more experienced judges - fewer mistakes get made. Team leaders are tasked with putting together best judging team with the pool of available judges.

Never been my experience to see a “Friends with benefits in high places” judge. That attitude would get you tossed off a national judging team in a heartbeat.

Dave

after reading some of the discussion on this board about certain areas of judging I don’t know how at any level of judging things can be consistent but maybe you guys act more civil on person As the threads nothing got resolved but more questions. In order for this hobby to grow maybe it needs to be looked at through new eyes and not through I been there done that for 40 years and I’m not changing

[David H.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

after reading some of the discussion on this board about certain areas of judging I don’t know how at any level of judging things can be consistent but maybe you guys act more civil on person As the threads nothing got resolved but more questions. In order for this hobby to grow maybe it needs to be looked at through new eyes and not through I been there done that for 40 years and I’m not changing

Keith

Judging schools, National Judges Retreat (next March), Observer Judge at Regional/National, etc are all efforts to improve quality and consistency of judging. Agree some threads on Tech Board don’t appear to be resolved - often response is to just read judging manual/standard deduction guidelines documents - answers often there. National Judging Chairman sometimes weighs in on a thread, but realistically Tech Board is not a good method for judges training - why there are schools etc. Member can always direct their question to appropriate team leader if tech board responses seem unsatisfactory.

NCRS Board members seem very open to “new eyes” member insights/suggestions for growing membership. Forward your suggestions to Regional Director or speak-up at Regional & National Townhalls. Clearly changes in Paint Judging, Concours Judging and Social Media are efforts to address restoration materials availability and expand membership.

Dave

[Michael J.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

Dave is right, changes do happen when enough people suggest things. I have been suggesting that paint color only be judged outside in the sunlight, as inconsistent interior lights and thus color rendition lead to inconsistent judging. I have been suggesting that the exterior judges judge only color outside during Operations judging (some used to anyway), and thus greater consistency in exterior judging (one of the most subjective) could improve. No changes have happened in the paint judging so far, but we have to keep suggesting changes.

[Edward J.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

I commend the owners and restorers that worked so hard to achieve this kind of score, I know just how it is to achieve just a 94 or 97.

[Elio M.]

Re: 1967 Perfect Restoration

I cant help but find this humorous even though I guess it should be insulted. First off I am not a doctor, lawyer or dentist, I am a midyear corvette restorer only. Picture for "effect". This is my job and I am damn good at it and I am good at it because of the help of many knowledgeable judges that help educate us every time we bring a car out. The car that scored 100% was painted 3 time during the judging process to insure the correct level of detail, even when the judges said "leave it alone". Not to mention the NOS parts and hours of refurbishing parts to satisfy our needs. I have personally spent years judging NCRS even a few as a nation team leader and find it insulting that this level of ignorance is coming from someone who is supposedly knowledgeable enough to conduct technical schools at regionals. Any half ass judge can pick on finishes but I dare either of you two ignorant jack offs to find 20 legitimate points on either of our cars! Frank Tetro is my only real competition in this high end market and I would be surprised if a day goes by we don't speak on the phone. We recognize that its beneficial to help each other instead of tear each other down, kinda like this bull**** thread!