1969 Map Pocket Variations?

[Paul S.]

I have noticed two slightly different configurations for the map pocket on early C3s ('69 and up in this case, since '68 didn't have the pocket).

On some, the flap and stitching for the lower "double pocket" ends at the edge of the part of the pocket that is visible when installed.

On others, this flap and the stitching for it extend into the two slots in the dash and go all the way to the very edge of the map pocket. This is the style currently reproduced, but I also have a NOS GM map pocket from the later 70's, and it is this style as well.

The latest judging guide for '69 clearly shows the latter style in the map pocket photo, but I actually tend to see the former style on most known-original '69s.

So what gives? Were both styles used in '69? Did a switch from the first to the second style occur at some point in the model year run? Anyone else ever notice this besides me? =)


Thanks,
Paul

[Gary B.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

Picture? Pretty please? Close up, if you have access to both styles, picture of both please.
The picture in the 68-69 TIM&JG is from a 69, Riverside Gold, Saddle, 6k miles. 5-Star Bowtie, etc.... It would surprise me if it had been changed. Wonder if colors had anything to do with it. Another thing to look at :-)
Sitting next to the Riverside Gold 69 is a September 68 built Silver 69, black interior. I'll look at it also. Later this next week.
Gary Bosselman

[Paul S.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

Ok, here we go. Style #1:




Style #2: (The photo below is from a later '70s dash, hence the stitching on it, but the map pocket is the style I've seen on a few presumed-original '69s, including the one pictured in the most recent judging guide as an example of what the '69 map pocket should look like...)

[Gary B.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

Thanks for the pictures. Appreciate it.
I guess i have not paid attention to that.
Note style #2 also has the stitching around the periphery of the map pocket also.
I'll look this week and report back what I see on some other cars. I have an early 70 here, I can look at that tomorrow.
Gary B

[Paul S.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

Note style #2 also has the stitching around the periphery of the map pocket also.
Gary B

The dash stitching is due to the fact that the dash is not from a '69. Starting in 1970, the dash has that stitching. You can ignore that for the purposes of this conversation -- I just could not find a photo of a '69 dash with that style of map pocket. Maybe I just should have scanned the one in the judging guide...

[Patrick H.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

Gary,

Did we differentiate the circumferential stitching of the whole pocket area to show 69 vs 70-and-later?
I don’t recall that we did.

Patrick

[Gary B.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

Patrick, no we did not. Something I have never noticed. I rarely judge interior.
The more I know, learn about these cars, the more I realize I don't know...
Gotta go into the big city this week and look at cars.
Gary B

[Patrick H.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

As you know Chuck has me judging Interior more, but I never noticed either.

Would be interesting to see Terry's car or early 70s to see what they have, as well as late 69s. If 70 style carpet started late 69, why not 70 style dash?

[Paul S.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

If 70 style carpet started late 69, why not 70 style dash?

I kinda doubt this, as that '70s dash also has stitching on the left side where it sits against the center gauge cluster. This would mean the car would have to have the stitching on the console, other side of the dash, etc. like a '70 model to match. I doubt something like this would have been missed over the years if it appeared on any '69s, as that would be a very obvious difference.

Now, the map pocket is another story, as the difference between the two styles there is very subtle. Can owners of '69s with known original map pockets please check which style they have? I suspect that the first style was used for most of '69 and then replaced by the second style late in the model year run, as I have seen way more of style #1 and only a handful of style #2 on '69 dashes, but I am looking to prove this hypothesis.

Also, does anyone know the build date of the Riverside Gold one used for the map pocket photo in the latest judging guide? If it was built late in the model year, that would support my hypothesis, since it has style #2 of map pocket. (Which, by the way, is the style I believe I have always seen on '70 and up models.)

[Jeffrey S.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

Attached is a photo of my October 68 car. Stitching does not extend past double pocket.
Jeff

[Donald S.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

I'm not quite sure what you're referring to, but here are a couple of pictures of the map pocket from my Nov 69 built 69...about as close to the end of production as you can get...Don.

[Gary B.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

From Terry's McManmon's very early 70. Mid-January built car.
Gary B

[Patrick H.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

So the change does appear to be at the model year changeover with regard to the circumferential stitching. Nice to know for the future.

Now we have to determine when in 69 the stitching of the map pocket started to extend.

[Paul S.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

Thanks, all! So far, my theory about the first style of map pocket being used in early '69 and the second style being used in late '69 and carrying over into '70 seems to be holding up! Please keep those pics coming! If we get enough, maybe we can determine a rough switch-over date.

[Terry M.]

Re: 1969 Map Pocket Variations?

Way too late in the morning for me after a "red eye" flight, but: I thought someone above suggested that interior color might be another variable. If I am mixing up threads consider that subject raised here.