R12 Refrigerant

[Brad Hillhouse (37766)]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

Millions of men had 3 or 4 cans of R12 on a shelf in the garage that has been sitting there since the 1970s. Now their kids are cleaning out the garage and know R12 is valuable, but dont know where to go with it. I have had 100% success finding it local on Craigslist and Facebook marketplace every time I want to buy some. Usually $15-20 a can gets me as much as I want - no license, no questions. A 30lb container of Freon may be useful for a commercial shop, but unless you have a fleet of R12 equipped cars, its just one more thing to have taking up space in the garage. But 4 cans and start enjoying cool AC in your Corvette!

Brad Hillhouse

[Jim S.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

1 CASE (12 CANS) OF DUPONT IGLOO R-12 WITH DYTEL REFRIGERANT FREON AC 12OZ CANS

Brand New
$255.00
Time left3d left (Tue, 05:08 PM)6 bids
+$44.38 shipping

[James H.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

DO NOT CONTAMINATE what R-12 that is your system with the replacement crap that you mentioned. If you ever take it in and they have to reclaim the refrigerant in your system, most shops today have a tester that will tell them what is in your system. If it is anything other than what it is supposed to be, they will not reclaim it.

Appreciate the info Dick

[James H.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

Millions of men had 3 or 4 cans of R12 on a shelf in the garage that has been sitting there since the 1970s. Now their kids are cleaning out the garage and know R12 is valuable, but dont know where to go with it. I have had 100% success finding it local on Craigslist and Facebook marketplace every time I want to buy some. Usually $15-20 a can gets me as much as I want - no license, no questions. A 30lb container of Freon may be useful for a commercial shop, but unless you have a fleet of R12 equipped cars, its just one more thing to have taking up space in the garage. But 4 cans and start enjoying cool AC in your Corvette!


Brad Hillhouse

Thanks Brad. I saw some, but they were $50 and up, plus the off brands that aren't really R12. I just want to make sure I purchase the right product. Jimmy said he had some I could purchase so that is how I will go. I will also keep an eye on Ebay, etc., for some that is more reasonably priced should the need arise again.

[Tom L.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

R12 is R12 regardless of the manufacturer. The chemical name is: Dichlorodifluoromethane If the can you buy says anything different it is not R12. As for mixing refrigerants, like Dick said, bad idea PERIOD. If a shop will reclaim it they will charge you dearly to dispose of it because it it your property and your responsibility to properly dispose of it. Let the chemists do their work in the lab.

As others have said, R12 is readily available if you want to pay the price. My wholesaler can deliver a skid of 30 lb. cylinders by Tuesday if anyone is interested : ) There's tons of old inventory out there that no one wants, that includes all the other CFC's and CFC blends that have been used for years. I have small cans and a 30 lb. cylinder of R12, as well as a few blends that I no longer use, that I haven't touched in years. Aside from this application R12 essentially obsolete.

Just a note, someone mentioned Propane as a refrigerant, that is R290. Get used to seeing it. All small commercial refrigeration equipment is currently using R290. Some are using R600, Isobutane, the stuff in lighters.

[Larry M.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

Tom:

What is a typical wholesale price for a 30 lb jug of R12??

Trying to stay calibrated.

Larry

[Tom L.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

Was curious so I looked to see what the chemical makeup of R12a is. I found very little technical data on the stuff since it doesn't have an ASHRAE designation. I did find this quote on a couple of sites, "HC-12a is a mixture of hydrocarbons, specifically propane (R-290) and isobutane (R-600a)." So it is a hydrocarbon blend and not a pure refrigerant. Also saw the link below, some interesting reading.

One thing I do know is that on small, self contained Commercial refrigeration the quantity of refrigerant is limited to a maximum of about 5.75 oz. because of its flammability. Even though the charge of Hydrocarbon refrigerants is less than 50% of R12 and R134a I think you'd be over that number in a vette. If legality of using this is an issue to you, you should check laws in your state.Hope this helps.

http://widit.knu.ac.kr/epa/ebtpages/...ut/s4out9.html

[Tom L.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

I'll have to check, its been a loooong time since I've asked. I'll try to remember this week. I do think it's south of the $999 that someone mentioned.

[Larry M.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

Was curious so I looked to see what the chemical makeup of R12a is. I found very little technical data on the stuff since it doesn't have an ASHRAE designation. I did find this quote on a couple of sites, "HC-12a is a mixture of hydrocarbons, specifically propane (R-290) and isobutane (R-600a)." So it is a hydrocarbon blend and not a pure refrigerant. Also saw the link below, some interesting reading.

One thing I do know is that on small, self contained Commercial refrigeration the quantity of refrigerant is limited to a maximum of about 5.75 oz. because of its flammability. Even though the charge of Hydrocarbon refrigerants is less than 50% of R12 and R134a I think you'd be over that number in a vette. If legality of using this is an issue to you, you should check laws in your state.Hope this helps.

http://widit.knu.ac.kr/epa/ebtpages/...ut/s4out9.html

Some additional info: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HC-12a

Can't always believe what "wiki" says, but this info is offered up for your review and consideration.

For systems using the A6 compressor, the weak link is the front seal. If you really want to drive your car, get the ALMA A6 compressor with better and modern front seal and better internal design. Charge correctly with R12 (maybe one time) and be happy.

Larry

PS: Trying to keep the original 50+ year old compressor working in your car will be problematic with the front seal. They were not that perfect when new.

[James H.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

R12 is R12 regardless of the manufacturer. The chemical name is: Dichlorodifluoromethane If the can you buy says anything different it is not R12. As for mixing refrigerants, like Dick said, bad idea PERIOD. If a shop will reclaim it they will charge you dearly to dispose of it because it it your property and your responsibility to properly dispose of it. Let the chemists do their work in the lab.

As others have said, R12 is readily available if you want to pay the price. My wholesaler can deliver a skid of 30 lb. cylinders by Tuesday if anyone is interested : ) There's tons of old inventory out there that no one wants, that includes all the other CFC's and CFC blends that have been used for years. I have small cans and a 30 lb. cylinder of R12, as well as a few blends that I no longer use, that I haven't touched in years. Aside from this application R12 essentially obsolete.

Just a note, someone mentioned Propane as a refrigerant, that is R290. Get used to seeing it. All small commercial refrigeration equipment is currently using R290. Some are using R600, Isobutane, the stuff in lighters.

Thank you Tom

[Dick W.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

Tom:

What is a typical wholesale price for a 30 lb jug of R12??

Trying to stay calibrated.

Larry

[James H.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

Some additional info: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HC-12a

Can't always believe what "wiki" says, but this info is offered up for your review and consideration.

For systems using the A6 compressor, the weak link is the front seal. If you really want to drive your car, get the ALMA A6 compressor with better and modern front seal and better internal design. Charge correctly with R12 (maybe one time) and be happy.

Larry

PS: Trying to keep the original 50+ year old compressor working in your car will be problematic with the front seal. They were not that perfect when new.

Thanks Larry!

[Larry M.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

Dick:

Perhaps the more correct term(s) would be "reclaimer" and buying at jobbers cost. R12 is being constantly reclaimed from commercial and industrial refrigeration equipment. They have enough refrigerant inventory that venting it is not an option, and some money can at least be obtained by selling to a reclaimer.

The dirty R12 is then redistilled and should be as new. But they need places/markets to sell it into. Not much of those left.

I was hoping maybe the reclaimed R12 could be purchased from a reclaimer thru a wholesaler or dealer for about $300 or so.........with retail mark-up to maybe $400 for a 30 lb jug. That is about what R22 is going for today.

Pretty soon R134a production will be restricted and phased out. But most of us old guys probably won't be around to see it. I know I probably won't......and won't care either if I am.

Larry

[Dick W.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

Dick:

Perhaps the more correct term(s) would be "reclaimer" and buying at jobbers cost. R12 is being constantly reclaimed from commercial and industrial refrigeration equipment. They have enough refrigerant inventory that venting it is not an option, and some money can at least be obtained by selling to a reclaimer.

The dirty R12 is then redistilled and should be as new. But they need places/markets to sell it into. Not much of those left.

I was hoping maybe the reclaimed R12 could be purchased from a reclaimer thru a wholesaler or dealer for about $300 or so.........with retail mark-up to maybe $400 for a 30 lb jug. That is about what R22 is going for today.

Pretty soon R134a production will be restricted and phased out. But most of us old guys probably won't be around to see it. I know I probably won't......and won't care either if I am.

Larry

R-22 retail price is almost $800 for 30#.

[Tom L.]

Re: R12 Refrigerant

Well I did get the cost of R12. The company I got the quote from is United refrigeration. A world wide company with over 400 branches that not only distributes refrigeration and air conditioning equipment, refrigerants and parts they also manufacture all of them. They are a big player. I was quoted $1025 for a 30 lb. cylinder, $1222 with NYS tax. I was shocked at the cost, I had thought the price had gone down due to low demand.

So at that price you'd be paying $40/lb. Obviously things are cheaper in quantities so I did some math. I regularly see 12 oz. cans of R12 for $30 or more on eBay, Craigs list, etc.. If you pay $30 for a 12 oz. can that's $40/lb. Given the small quantity a bargain at $30 per can. So if you're interested in a cylinder and have a refrigerant handling certification google URI.com and run out and get yours!