Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them? - NCRS Discussion Boards

Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Patrick T.
    Expired
    • September 30, 1999
    • 1286

    Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

    A friend of mine who I haven't seen or heard from in a couple years told me back then the '67 frame does NOT have a date written upside down on the frame. The car has a National Top Flite and a Bloominton Gold awards. On the '66 and earlier productions there was a date on the side rail as shown in the picture below. Can anyone confirm for sure that the '67's did not have a date scrawled on the frame rail? Thanks, PT

  • Bill W.
    Very Frequent User
    • November 1, 1977
    • 402

    #2
    Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

    Patrick, Don't know about '67's, but my #23514 '66 that I ordered does not have a date hand written on the frame. There is a date included in the stenciled part number at the back of the frame, but nothing else except shim markes on the right side. Bill

    Comment

    • Stephen L.
      Extremely Frequent Poster
      • May 31, 1984
      • 3148

      #3
      Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

      If you look closely at the stenciled number in the frame photo there is no date incorporated in the stencil, thus a date was written on the frame.

      In 1967 and possibly after (I'm no expert on this except for my own 67 Frame) the date was included in the frame part number, thus it was not necessary to handwrite a date on the frame.

      This gets back to the "frame pull date" discussions. IMHO the "Frame Pull Date" was NOT a date that the frame was "pulled" but rather the date the frame was manufactured, just like nearly everything else made by vendors with a manufacture date stamped on it.

      Why would GM care when the frame was "pulled" when all the other vendors placed a date on their product when they made it? GM didn't put a "used on" date on anything else. Even engines were stamped on the manufactured date, not the date they were installed on the frame.

      Comment

      • Kirk M.
        Extremely Frequent Poster
        • June 30, 2006
        • 1036

        #4
        Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

        So, what is the short answer here? Did 67's have a hand-written date on the pass side frame rail or not? Yes or No.

        Next, what is the accepted answer to that same question according to the NCRS judging guides? ie: it's nice to have the opinion (right or wrong) but will I get dinked if my frame doesn't have a date?

        Kirk

        Comment

        • Patrick T.
          Expired
          • September 30, 1999
          • 1286

          #5
          Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

          Originally posted by Kirk McHugh (46057)
          So, what is the short answer here? Did 67's have a hand-written date on the pass side frame rail or not? Yes or No.

          Next, what is the accepted answer to that same question according to the NCRS judging guides? ie: it's nice to have the opinion (right or wrong) but will I get dinked if my frame doesn't have a date?

          Kirk
          Kirk, ditto on your question, as I have never seen the answer published anywhere. PT

          Comment

          • Michael H.
            Expired
            • January 29, 2008
            • 7477

            #6
            Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

            Originally posted by Stephen Lavigne (7553)
            This gets back to the "frame pull date" discussions. IMHO the "Frame Pull Date" was NOT a date that the frame was "pulled" but rather the date the frame was manufactured, just like nearly everything else made by vendors with a manufacture date stamped on it.

            Why would GM care when the frame was "pulled" when all the other vendors placed a date on their product when they made it? GM didn't put a "used on" date on anything else. Even engines were stamped on the manufactured date, not the date they were installed on the frame.
            The hand written frame date was put on all C2 frames until some point in mid 66 production right at the St Louis plant, just before the frame was pulled from the "short stack" inside the building. That's why it's possible to see a frame date and body trim tag date that matches.

            For later 66, and for the next several years, the part number stencil included the date. That would have been put on at the frame source, not the St Louis plant so it would be at minimum one and possibly several days before the body date.

            At some point during C3 production, the St Louis plant began to use the hand written date again for a short time but I don't remember when. The stencil also had the date from Smith.

            Comment

            • Henry S.
              Expired
              • April 30, 2005
              • 816

              #7
              Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

              Originally posted by Michael Hanson (4067)
              The hand written frame date was put on all C2 frames until some point in mid 66 production right at the St Louis plant, just before the frame was pulled from the "short stack" inside the building. That's why it's possible to see a frame date and body trim tag date that matches.

              For later 66, and for the next several years, the part number stencil included the date. That would have been put on at the frame source, not the St Louis plant so it would be at minimum one and possibly several days before the body date.

              At some point during C3 production, the St Louis plant began to use the hand written date again for a short time but I don't remember when. The stencil also had the date from Smith.
              Sooooo......... no 67 had a hand written date on the frame?? And if it does it's wrong?? Damn.....why is this is hard.

              Comment

              • John H.
                Beyond Control Poster
                • December 1, 1997
                • 16513

                #8
                Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

                Originally posted by Kirk McHugh (46057)
                So, what is the short answer here? Did 67's have a hand-written date on the pass side frame rail or not? Yes or No.

                Next, what is the accepted answer to that same question according to the NCRS judging guides? ie: it's nice to have the opinion (right or wrong) but will I get dinked if my frame doesn't have a date?

                Kirk
                Kirk -

                Your answer is in the '67 JG, under "Frame" in the Chassis section (no "pull date" is noted for 67's).

                I spent my entire career in assembly plants (including St. Louis-Corvette), and I have no idea why St. Louis put the "pull date" on '63-'66 frames; somebody (internal or external) told them to, so they did. Who that was or why, we'll probably never know - there was no logical reason to do so.

                Comment

                • Kirk M.
                  Extremely Frequent Poster
                  • June 30, 2006
                  • 1036

                  #9
                  Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

                  Originally posted by John Hinckley (29964)
                  Kirk -

                  Your answer is in the '67 JG, under "Frame" in the Chassis section (no "pull date" is noted for 67's).

                  I spent my entire career in assembly plants (including St. Louis-Corvette), and I have no idea why St. Louis put the "pull date" on '63-'66 frames; somebody (internal or external) told them to, so they did. Who that was or why, we'll probably never know - there was no logical reason to do so.
                  John,

                  I don't doubt you for a minute, but my 4th Edition says nothing like that

                  "The frame is painted semi-gloss black. Both the Dow Smith number, 303196, and the GM number, 900200, appear upside down and toward the rear on the right frame rail. A date is also stenciled beside these numbers. Several variations of this stencil have been observed. The following is one example:"

                  That is it. Is there a newer addition? This is the 67 NCRS Tech Info Manual and Tech Guide. Am I missing it somewhere?

                  Dang, I just dated mine a couple weeks back based on Quanta spec sheet. Guess I need to remove it!

                  Comment

                  • Patrick T.
                    Expired
                    • September 30, 1999
                    • 1286

                    #10
                    Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

                    Originally posted by John Hinckley (29964)
                    Kirk -

                    Your answer is in the '67 JG, under "Frame" in the Chassis section (no "pull date" is noted for 67's).

                    I spent my entire career in assembly plants (including St. Louis-Corvette), and I have no idea why St. Louis put the "pull date" on '63-'66 frames; somebody (internal or external) told them to, so they did. Who that was or why, we'll probably never know - there was no logical reason to do so.
                    Thanks John, I had looked in the '67 Judging Manual for this item but had no idea what a "no pull date" was. PT

                    Comment

                    • John H.
                      Beyond Control Poster
                      • December 1, 1997
                      • 16513

                      #11
                      Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

                      Originally posted by Kirk McHugh (46057)
                      John,

                      I don't doubt you for a minute, but my 4th Edition says nothing like that

                      "The frame is painted semi-gloss black. Both the Dow Smith number, 303196, and the GM number, 900200, appear upside down and toward the rear on the right frame rail. A date is also stenciled beside these numbers. Several variations of this stencil have been observed. The following is one example:"

                      That is it. Is there a newer addition? This is the 67 NCRS Tech Info Manual and Tech Guide. Am I missing it somewhere?

                      Dang, I just dated mine a couple weeks back based on Quanta spec sheet. Guess I need to remove it!
                      Kirk -

                      The "date" noted in your (current) 4th Edition refers to the date that's part of the stencil, which is on all 67's. The "pull date" being discussed was hand-scrawled with a grease pencil or lumber crayon, separate from the A.O. Smith stencil, and was not applied to '67 frames.

                      Comment

                      • Kirk M.
                        Extremely Frequent Poster
                        • June 30, 2006
                        • 1036

                        #12
                        Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

                        Originally posted by John Hinckley (29964)
                        Kirk -

                        The "date" noted in your (current) 4th Edition refers to the date that's part of the stencil, which is on all 67's. The "pull date" being discussed was hand-scrawled with a grease pencil or lumber crayon, separate from the A.O. Smith stencil, and was not applied to '67 frames.
                        I understand, I'm talking about removing the hand-written paint stick date that I so expertly stood on my head to incorrectly apply to my 67 frame. Unfortunately, the literature from Quanta does NOT make an exception notation about the hand-written date for 67's, so I proceeded to apply it thinking I was doing good. No problem, it will wipe off with thinner. As always, thanks for the direct and clear answer John!

                        Kirk

                        Comment

                        • Mike M.
                          Director Region V
                          • August 31, 1994
                          • 1463

                          #13
                          Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

                          Hello Patrick.
                          Since the Chassis Judging Sheets, Section 11, states "Frame & Numbers"
                          Judges typically look for the A. O. Smith Stenciled numbers.
                          I do not and have not heard of Judges deducting for the absence of the handwritten "Pull Date".
                          HaND

                          Comment

                          • Patrick T.
                            Expired
                            • September 30, 1999
                            • 1286

                            #14
                            Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

                            Originally posted by Mike Murray (25129)
                            Hello Patrick.
                            Since the Chassis Judging Sheets, Section 11, states "Frame & Numbers"
                            Judges typically look for the A. O. Smith Stenciled numbers.
                            I do not and have not heard of Judges deducting for the absence of the handwritten "Pull Date".
                            HaND
                            Mike, I have a late St. Louis built '67. A couple years ago I took off the date and it will stay off. Thanks, PT

                            P.S. I will give your post to the Chassis Judge when the big day comes for my car to get judged!

                            Comment

                            • Mike M.
                              Director Region V
                              • August 31, 1994
                              • 1463

                              #15
                              Re: Did '67 frame rails have a date written on them?

                              Hello Patrick.
                              Be careful what you wish for, that judge could be me.
                              HaND

                              Comment

                              Working...

                              Debug Information

                              Searching...Please wait.
                              An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because you have logged in since the previous page was loaded.

                              Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                              An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because the token has expired.

                              Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                              An internal error has occurred and the module cannot be displayed.
                              There are no results that meet this criteria.
                              Search Result for "|||"