Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

[Greg L.]

I know what my answer is but I'm currious to see what you all think?

[Warren F.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

I would want factory documentation to verify the desireable seldom ordered high performance options that could have been ordered on the Corvettes. Personally I would prefer to have all the various types of paperwork that accompanied these cars through the various channels of production and sales when new, however for the years I prefer, '68 through '72, having one of the Corvette Order Copy's, Shipping Copy, Window Invoice would be a big plus. Protect-0-Plate w/Warranty Pamphlet would also be a big plus. Dealer Sales Invoice would be nice, especially for the earlier models.

[Jack C.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

I would be curious to see when "the need for documentation" became the buzzword in the hobby. My guess would be around the same time when folks realized that counterfeiting could be so profitable.

[Tim G.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

I always prefer cars with at least one piece of factory paperwork. I consider factory paperwork a POP, window sticker, or build/tank sheet.
Supporting paperwork from the dealer is a plus, but it's not factory paperwork.

Factory paperwork is more important to me with rarer options, like a 427 engine or rare color option. A car is just a big mystery with no paperwork, although the new NCRS information can sure help provide some insight as to where the car came from.

[Edward M.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

We all realize, I hope, that paperwork is easier to fake than the car itself. Authenticating the paperwork is a different, and equally important, skill set.

Agreed that authentic paperwork is a plus. The more valuable the car, the more important the authentic paperwork.

[Domenic T.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

The paper work I threw away, (Tank sticker) in 1971 was one, was in terrible shape 4 years after the car was made and it was a CA car.

It was dusty and moisture stained and I didn't want it on my tank.

I don't remember the other stuff I threw away but at the time no one cared about paper work.

My car was born a 427/435 and will live the rest of it's life with some people saying it's a fake.

I didn't want the BB either because of the valve trane problems they had at the time so I put a 365/327 in it till the 80's then rebuilt the BB and it sits in it now.

I wish I didn't do that but I think one who saved the paper work knew that one day someone would want it???

NIce to have if it's real.

DOM

[Philip A.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

Paper work is faked/forged too!

[Michael J.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

I always like to have as much as possible when I buy a car if it is a high $$ car, realizing fakes are possible you have to do the best you can. I have become a paperwork junkie when I buy a new car now, considering how little remains for older ones. When I recently took NCM delivery of my new ZR1, they gave me everything that was ever with or on the car, even a rolled up bunch of plastic that used to cover various items, I will keep it all and pass to the next owner, if there is one .

Here is a picture of her, with her grandmother:

[Paul J.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

Greg, obviously documents provide verification that the car is what it was, and assures buyers that they are not getting ripped off. Therefore, you can demand a higher price for a "certified" car. However, there are those that doubt the authenticity of both the cars and the documents, perhaps with good reason. So it really comes down to the same thing you need to do whenever you buy any collectable car, you need to do your homework.

Documents only mean something when you are selling a car, and they mean very little if the car is a restomod, or heavily modified.

Paul

[Greg L.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

Thanks guys, here are my thoughts.

I really don't put much weight on paperwork unless I can tell for sure that it's real. POPs, tanks stickers, etc are all repoped to a very high level and I don't have the experience to tell a good fake from the real deal like many of you could.
If I felt a car was the real deal and it had a good tank sticker or POP I'd probably accept that as a little insurance.

To me the ultimate doc would be from GM of Canada and that is all I would need. You can't get any better than from the "horses mouth". The problem is that very few cars were sold through them so the odds of getting one of these is remote.

The next best would be to have Al Grenning perform his service on the stamp pad and give it his certification.

I just feel that these two options eliminate the possibility of fraud on the sellers part. I just don't really trust paper work these days.

[Robert G.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

I look at documentation as another opportunity for the seller to make a mistake. There are so many ways to screw up documentation, yet a car could have been modified over the years for many reasons. You don't modify documentation for anything but deception.

[Mark S.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

I look at documentation as another opportunity for the seller to make a mistake. There are so many ways to screw up documentation, yet a car could have been modified over the years for many reasons. You don't modify documentation for anything but deception.

True, but how many legitimate cars have fake docs. My guess is a good many. IMO too much emphasis is put on documentation. It is as easy or easier to fake then the car itself yet there are people that will put down an otherwise correct and original car because it has no documentation.

The new NCRS documentation verification should help with fakes. I wish the NCRS could use this information to actively seek out and identify fake documentation.

[Edward S.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

Instead of wishing that NCRS could police the hobby when it comes to documentation - as I had mentioned many months ago it would be easier for GM to take anyone making fake forms which contain Chevy logos on the form to court. I would think it would be fairly easy to prevent anyone from making copies of those logos without GM approval or paying very large fees yearly to do so. I would think that with all the money we spend to get our cars in shape and stay that way ( which has to be a plus for car companies ) they should be looking into ways to offer us some protection. When I brought this up before, it seemed to be of little interest to our members. If GM would get behind us it would really raise the value of real documentation. Would be nice if it was a perfect world we live in.

[Dennis O.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

I'm glad I have small blocks and plan on keeping them.

[Gene M.]

Re: Why do we want Docs and what/how much is enough?

Instead of wishing that NCRS could police the hobby when it comes to documentation - as I had mentioned many months ago it would be easier for GM to take anyone making fake forms which contain Chevy logos on the form to court. I would think it would be fairly easy to prevent anyone from making copies of those logos without GM approval or paying very large fees yearly to do so. I would think that with all the money we spend to get our cars in shape and stay that way ( which has to be a plus for car companies ) they should be looking into ways to offer us some protection. When I brought this up before, it seemed to be of little interest to our members. If GM would get behind us it would really raise the value of real documentation. Would be nice if it was a perfect world we live in.

All sounds nice......but will never happen, there is nothing in it for GM (no $) it would cost more than ever could be gained. A loser before the start.

I don't know about everybody else but I drive the Corvette not the paper work. I know my cars are real and I don't need any piece of paper to say so. As far as value that is something my daughters and grandsons can deal with when I'm pushing up daises...........