Keys for judging?

[Mike F.]

For judging, should the second set of keys be left as blanks or cut to fit the ignition/lock?

[Harmon C.]

Re: Keys for judging?

They need to be cut and must work to lock and unlock.

[Gary B.]

Re: Keys for judging?

Mike,

You should have a total of four keys (not counting a possible B&S alarm key, which I can't recall existed for which years), all with functional key cuts. Among those four GM keys, you should have two identical "large-head" square keys, and two identical "large-head" oval keys. The letter keyways for the 70-72 years are:

70: J & K
71: A & B
72: C & D

Gary

[Jeffrey S.]

Re: Keys for judging?

One small correction, very minor. It is my understanding that the keys that are correct for the car and are judged with the interior do not have to work anything. The operation of the locks is handled during operations and any keys can be used. If this is wrong I would appreciate someone stepping in.
Jeff

[Mike F.]

Re: Keys for judging?

Jeff,

You are correct that the keys are only to be judged for quantity and appearance, per 1970-72 TIMJG page 28.

My interpretation of the TIMJG was that it was vague on whether the second set of keys needed to be cut or not. (Looks like they do.)

[Gary B.]

Re: Keys for judging?

Jeff,

I checked the '66 TIM&JG and you are correct that the function of the keys in the various locks is assessed during OPs. The originality and condition of the keys, at least for '66, is judged with the Interior assessment, during the ignition switch portion of the Controls section. I presume during that originality assessment, a judge would detect and deduct for the lack of cuts on any key. But you are correct that the function of any key is not assessed during the Interior judging.

I suppose during the OPs check, a judge might check the function of all four keys, which again would catch any uncut keys. So it seems like the issue of having any uncut keys could arise both during OPs (for function) and during the Interior judging (for originality).

Gary

[Reba W.]

Re: Keys for judging?

Altough we interior judges do not test the keys, I would expect them to be cut. If not, that is a deduction under configuration. We do also look for the correct keyway code.

[Jeff P.]

Re: Keys for judging?

And the knock-outs can be knocked out ?

[Gary B.]

Re: Keys for judging?

Jeff,

The knockouts can either be in place, in the key, or separate (knocked out), otherwise there should be a judging deduct.

Gary

[Jeff P.]

Re: Keys for judging?

I've seen the keys on flea bay. I guess you take these to a locksmith and get a key code number stamped on them ? Is there a proper height stamp used for these?

[Terry M.]

Re: Keys for judging?

The key people are Gary Beaupre and Peter Lindahl. The size stamp is not so common. I know Pete can stamp them correctly. You will have to ask Gary if he can.
The key notches are sheared with a cutting tool, and not ground with a wheel. Yes the judges can discern the difference. Do it once and do it right.

Edit add: There is a difference in whether the key has a small hole or a large hole, and I think it depends on the year of your car. Check with the key people, the story they wrote for The Restorer, or the appropriate TIM&JG.

[Gary B.]

Re: Keys for judging?

...
Edit add: There is a difference in whether the key has a small hole or a large hole, and I think it depends on the year of your car. Check with the key people, the story they wrote for The Restorer, or the appropriate TIM&JG.

Terry,

For the large head keys that came into existence in '69, there is only one size hole (small) in the knockouts.

Gary

[Terry M.]

Re: Keys for judging?

Terry,

For the large head keys that came into existence in '69, there is only one size hole (small) in the knockouts.

Gary

Gary,
That is why I said it depends on the year of your car, but thanks for clarifying the C3 key hole size.

[Gary B.]

Re: Keys for judging?

The key people are Gary Beaupre and Peter Lindahl. The size stamp is not so common. I know Pete can stamp them correctly. You will have to ask Gary if he can....

Terry,

One can count on the fingers of one hand the number of people around the country who do a decent or better job at stamping keys intended for NCRS judging. Each person has his own unique, stamping fingerprint. While some locksmiths say they can stamp keys, they typically have not researched the correct font style and size. As you aptly state, do it once and do it right.

Pete is my personal choice for stamping keys intended for judging. His prices are fair and without question he stands behind his work.

Gary